My anticommercial thinking (POLL)

[hgm]

Well, if you come back here after figuring this out, we can have a long, quiet holiday, and you could still let people know that you are not a complete idiot. So everyone would be happy.

[geots]

And now try to connect to FICS with it! (Or set the options of a WinBoard engine...)

Not a problem connecting. Because I don't connect to anything with any guis. And you are smarter than that. I ran 30 or 40 winboard engines in Shredder 11 just like I do in the chessbase guis. I ran Scorpio gauntlets and Thinker gauntlets and God only knows what else. I don't think I ever ran a tournament in Shredder 11 that did not have winboard engines in it.

[hgm]

I cannot imagine anyone who, if they used the gui, would ever stop using it.

Note that you wrote anyone, and that is what I was reacting to. Anyone is not just you. So whether you never connect to anything is completely irrelevant.

It also seems you misunderstood my remark on WinBoard engines. I did not say Shredder Classic could not run WB engines (as seems to be the case with the ChessBase GUI). I said you couldn't set their options through the GUI.

For the sake of objectivity I just wanted to point out that there are actually plenty of shortcomings to this GUI that could be a reason for people preferring another one, whether you can imagine it or not. I know that I would not want it, and the poor implementation of WB protocol in itself would be enough reason for me to ask my money back, if I had actually bought it. (Which I didn't.)

[geots]

I cannot imagine anyone who, if they used the gui, would ever stop using it.

Note that you wrote anyone, and that is what I was reacting to. Anyone is not just you. So whether you never connect to anything is completely irrelevant.

It also seems you misunderstood my remark on WinBoard engines. I did not say Shredder Classic could not run WB engines (as seems to be the case with the ChessBase GUI). I said you couldn't set their options through the GUI.

For the sake of objectivity I just wanted to point out that there are actually plenty of shortcomings to this GUI that could be a reason for people preferring another one, whether you can imagine it or not. I know that I would not want it, and the poor implementation of WB protocol in itself would be enough reason for me to ask my money back, if I had actually bought it. (Which I didn't.)

So what. You can set any option that matters in a config. file or other-named file in the engine folder. I had much rather do that anyway than I had set parameter changes, save and have to load them every time I want to run the engine. But that is irrelevant, as I know you are going to tell me you don't have to do that either. Most of the engines I enjoy and use the most are UCI. I like and am comfortable with my guis, and you are comfortable and like yours. That doesn't make one better than the other. Just a matter of preference. Except I am not going to trash or find fault with the ones you use. And BTW, I don't use Shredder Classic. Don't even own it. Which again doesn't matter either. All it boils down to is that I wish you well with your gui(s) and if they are trouble free- I will be the first to tell you I am happy for you. Seriously- and no sarcasm at all intended, HG. And when I said "anybody that has used it"- I was referring to people who had been using chessbase or similar guis, and that once they tried this one, they would most likely keep using it in conjunction with chessbase guis or whatever. I would never even suggest it for someone who ran mostly all Winboard engines. I agree that would not make sense.

Anyway, if we have ever talked before- I just don't remember it. So let me close by saying that I read a lot of your threads and enjoy them. You're a smart guy and always have something interesting to read.

Best to you, HG-

george

[syzygy]

I cannot imagine anyone who, if they used the gui, would ever stop using it.

Note that you wrote anyone, and that is what I was reacting to. Anyone is not just you. So whether you never connect to anything is completely irrelevant.

Anal retentiveness

[hgm]

Ah, troll number two is back as well. Nothing intelligent to say on the subject, apparently not even able to understand what is written, and just disrupting orderly discussion in an attempt it would get somewhere...

[geots]

But I also agree that Junior is WAY overpriced. I mean WAY overpriced!

The commercial authors DO have realize they can't go berzerk on their priceing (JUNIOR!!) and they must offer a little something something extra as well. Shredder is AWESOME at this and it seems Hiarcs is going to follow that model as well.

Huh? Shredder and Junior are of comparable strength, but Shredder sells for €100 and Junior for €45 (compare to Rybka for €65/95, Houdini for €40 and Hiarcs for €30). Shredder is the engine that is grossly overpriced! I have delayed buying Shredder for years, waiting for them to come to their senses and lower their prices to the new market standard. Or to at least unbundle Deep Shredder from their GUI. Maybe they will finally figure this out when the new Hiarcs UI eats their lunch.

Well,first your price points aren't quite correct. However with Shredder you do get the GUI (which is my favorite!), a great opening book, the 3-4-5 man Shredderbases, access to all 6 man tables through the GUI and the Shredder website...so the price is reasonable. NOW if you don't like that GUI then I would understand and I agree it would be wise for Shredder to make a UCI only purchase option available.

I cannot imagine anyone who, if they used the gui, would ever stop using it. Besides being uncomplicated and user-friendly, like Fritz 11 it just gives no trouble whatsoever. The only thing that ever approached a problem was when I first started using it with Vista- it did not want to let me use an HS-Book. All I had to do was go into Data Execution Prevention and list the gui for it to leave alone. That's not even really what you would call a problem.

gts

I meant to ask this for a looong time. Is the loved Classic Shredder GUI the same as the Linux version with the same name? I downloaded the demo version it at the time I was porting Gaviota to be UCI, and I was not very impressed to say the least. I thought it would be "the golden standart for UCI support". I ended up using something else.

Maybe the Linux version is different?

Miguel

I really am not sure which Shredder gui you are talking about- because there is more than one. There is one they call Shredder Classic, but I think it is older- tho I may be wrong. The one I refer to is the Shredder 11 gui that he put out with Shredder 11 UCI. Really the only 2 small things I don't like is it shows no engine logos and in the PGNs for each game it does not show average ply depth and nps. But it does show evaluations and the rest. And you can access the database while the match is running. That I like. And it is the only gui that for me has always been bug-free. Very stable- like Fritz 11.

gts