Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

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carldaman
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by carldaman »

TShackel wrote:
consen wrote:GUNNARPC, Blitz 1m+1s 0


1 Stockfish 231014 64 SSE4.2 +6 +37/=177/-33 50,81% 125,5/247
2 Sugar v2.0d x64 SSE4.2 -6 +33/=177/-37 49,19% 121,5/247
Thanks for doing that. Yea, Sugar is very similar to stockfish and not quite as strong as stockfish. However it's stronger than other stockfish clones like Don. I'm not a programmer, so I don't know the exact similarities or differences from the official stockfish and sugar. I'm debating if I should test sugar in some tournaments or not. I really like original engines that earned their way up to being the strongest in the world. But I understand that stockfish was derived from glaurung as well.

I know that Houdini is influenced by ippolit, but I consider Houdini, Komodo, and Stockfish as distinctly different from one another, and it's nice to have very strong engines be very different from one another, but when you get lots of clones of the same engines you get all these strong engines with with the same character and that gets annoying. Fritz too is another great original program at least through version 13.0, now 14.0 is a pandix engine. Even if Fritz is not as strong as the other top engines now, it still offeres it's own distinct character, and I remember Fritz 7.0 was the only engine that could see all three king's indian theory moves (in the Nc6 d5 Ne7 variation), of b4, Ne1, and Nd2. Fritz 7.0 could see all three. All the top engines now can't see any, except for houdini whoh sees Ne1. So I love very different original programs that are very strong. But with the internet, and computer chess forums, and wiki programming, and open source engines, the trend is to get the top immediately by basing your work off of somebody else.

Thanks again.

Tim.
Something changed dramatically after Fritz 10. Some say it (v11-13) became more 'Rybka-like'. :roll:

CL
consen
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by consen »

GUNNARPC, Blitz 1m+1s 0


1 Stockfish 231014 64 SSE4.2 +7 +68/=385/-57 51,08% 260,5/510

2 Sugar v2.0d x64 SSE4.2 -7 +57/=385/-68 48,92% 249,5/510
Zerbinati
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by Zerbinati »

Sugar v2.0Extended 32-64 Bit
MinGW compile

Additions
UCI options extended parameter
SPSA tuning set of threatened pieces
Deletions
Delete Minor, Major Enemies
__________________________________

HISTORY TUNING Minor, Major

[PAWN] = make_score(a_m, a_e)

[KNIGHT] = make_score(b_m, b_e)

[BISHOP] = make_score(b_m, b_e)

[ROOK] = make_score(c_m, c_e)

[QUEEN] = make_score(d_m, d_e)

__________________________________
Sugar v2.0Ext 64-Bit AVX SSE4.2
Sugar v2.0Ext 64-Bit SSE4.2
Sugar v2.0Ext 64-Bit
Sugar v2.0Ext 64-Bit Gen
Sugar v2.0Ext 32-Bit sse
Sugar v2.0Ext 32-Bit old
Sugar v2.0Ext 32-Bit
_________________________
File Size: 1023.93KB
https://www.sendspace.com/file/ia1scz
_________________________________
Sugar v2.0E 32-64 Bit
MinGW compile

Additions
Change value Threat attacking bonus
Deletions
Tracing evaluation delete write add term
__________________________________
Sugar v2.0E 64-Bit AVX SSE4.2
Sugar v2.0E 64-Bit SSE4.2
Sugar v2.0E 64-Bit
Sugar v2.0E 64-Bit Gen
Sugar v2.0E 32-Bit sse
Sugar v2.0E 32-Bit old
Sugar v2.0E 32-Bit
__________________________________
File Size: 1.12MB
https://www.sendspace.com/file/qfjual

Regards

M.Z
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hgm
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by hgm »

TShackel wrote: I'm debating if I should test sugar in some tournaments or not. I really like original engines that earned their way up to being the strongest in the world. But I understand that stockfish was derived from glaurung as well.
The question is, would you also run tournaments which have the latest 20 (or so) Stockfish versions all participating. These might differ more from each other than Sugar differs from the latest Stockfish. So if you don't think it is necessary to run those, why run Sugar?

It is debatable whether merely changing the name of an engine makes it a derivative. Stockfish is not really 'derived from' Glaurung. It is Glaurung. In a sense the version number is also part of the name. Would Komodo 4 not be an original engine, because it was 'derived' from Komodo 3?
mcostalba
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by mcostalba »

hgm wrote: It is debatable whether merely changing the name of an engine makes it a derivative. Stockfish is not really 'derived from' Glaurung. It is Glaurung. In a sense the version number is also part of the name. Would Komodo 4 not be an original engine, because it was 'derived' from Komodo 3?
I don't know why you add confusion when it is not necessary nor required.

Stockfish is 'derived' (or as is common to say 'forked') from Glaurung in the open source way. If you have some doubts about what this very precise statement means please refer to open source docs. Instead if you don't have doubts and simply you think to know, then think again.

Regarding this engine, if sources are not available, as it seems the case, then it is simply an illegal engine and I have nothing more to add.
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hgm
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by hgm »

Forking in itself doesn't make something another engine. And AFAIK Glaurung development has stopped after (and even before) this 'fork' occurred. So it is more a sort of interesting 'one-pronged fork' (also known as an icepick. :lol: )
syzygy
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by syzygy »

hgm wrote:Forking in itself doesn't make something another engine. And AFAIK Glaurung development has stopped after (and even before) this 'fork' occurred. So it is more a sort of interesting 'one-pronged fork' (also known as an icepick. :lol: )
If you don't know your stuff, why not first do 10 seconds of research. And it's a bit hilarious to pretend that nothing was done to SF after it forked from Glaurung.
Zerbinati
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by Zerbinati »

mcostalba wrote:
hgm wrote:

Regarding this engine, if sources are not available, as it seems the case, then it is simply an illegal engine and I have nothing more to add.
Il codice sorgente di Sugar e sempre rilasciato potete controllare i link
_________________

The source code for Sugar and forever released, you can check the links

Regards

M.Z
Guest71
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by Guest71 »

The point is this. Marco Zerbinati always releases the source code and so this aspect makes the engine Sugar legal, otherwise I would not have asked the same thing again.
My question is: is it a clone or not ?!
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hgm
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Re: Sugar 2.0b x 64.0

Post by hgm »

syzygy wrote:
hgm wrote:Forking in itself doesn't make something another engine. And AFAIK Glaurung development has stopped after (and even before) this 'fork' occurred. So it is more a sort of interesting 'one-pronged fork' (also known as an icepick. :lol: )
If you don't know your stuff, why not first do 10 seconds of research. And it's a bit hilarious to pretend that nothing was done to SF after it forked from Glaurung.
What is hilarious is that you think I said that... :lol: