Three Knights vs Eight Pawns

[Uri Blass]

<Elephantiasis effect>
Strong pieces lose value in the presence of opponent weaker pieces. And there is no way to relax, for lack of suitable trading partners. The queen's base value is devalued since there ain't any equal trading partners available.

Tell it to the queen about pawns.

Tell her that she lose value in the presence of opponent weak pawns and I guess that "she" is going to laugh.

I think that
Queen d8 and king e8 against king and 8 white pawns is a clear win for the queen assuming the pawns are in ranks 2,3,4.

Can you build a position when the pawns draw?

I also wonder how many pawns in the first half of the board you need to beat a queen(I guess that beating 2 knights and a bishop is easier).

The pawns wins easily here:

[d]1nb1k1n1/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/5K2/8/8 w - - 0 1

[Lyudmil Tsvetkov]

this is unrepresentative: too few pawns, too small pawn span, favouring greatly the knights.

and the revolt of the peasants is more realistic??

certainly so.

you don't make a position, where queen side likes big pawn span and knight side small span, while on the other one just one side has a non-pawn piece.

in the first position, the aim is to evaluate how 3Qs do vs 7Ns, and conditions must be equal, which are not, while on the second position there is no preliminary condition matching pieces, just a random diagram, 3Ns + P vs 8 Ps, with specific board positions.

[Lyudmil Tsvetkov]

<Elephantiasis effect>
Strong pieces lose value in the presence of opponent weaker pieces. And there is no way to relax, for lack of suitable trading partners. The queen's base value is devalued since there ain't any equal trading partners available.

Tell it to the queen about pawns.

Tell her that she lose value in the presence of opponent weak pawns and I guess that "she" is going to laugh.

I think that
Queen d8 and king e8 against king and 8 white pawns is a clear win for the queen assuming the pawns are in ranks 2,3,4.

Can you build a position when the pawns draw?

I also wonder how many pawns in the first half of the board you need to beat a queen(I guess that beating 2 knights and a bishop is easier).

The pawns wins easily here:

[d]1nb1k1n1/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/5K2/8/8 w - - 0 1

those are not just pawns, but quality pawns: advanced pawns, connected pawns.

build the same position with all pawns on ranks 2 or 3, and the minors easily win that.

[Uri Blass]

<Elephantiasis effect>
Strong pieces lose value in the presence of opponent weaker pieces. And there is no way to relax, for lack of suitable trading partners. The queen's base value is devalued since there ain't any equal trading partners available.

Tell it to the queen about pawns.

Tell her that she lose value in the presence of opponent weak pawns and I guess that "she" is going to laugh.

I think that
Queen d8 and king e8 against king and 8 white pawns is a clear win for the queen assuming the pawns are in ranks 2,3,4.

Can you build a position when the pawns draw?

I also wonder how many pawns in the first half of the board you need to beat a queen(I guess that beating 2 knights and a bishop is easier).

The pawns wins easily here:

[d]1nb1k1n1/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/5K2/8/8 w - - 0 1

those are not just pawns, but quality pawns: advanced pawns, connected pawns.

build the same position with all pawns on ranks 2 or 3, and the minors easily win that.

These quality pawns are going to lose against a queen and I am not sure if the minors win when all the pawns are in the 3th rank

[d]1nb1k1n1/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/5K2/8 w - - 0 1

stockfish believes 1.g4 is equal but did not analyze for a long time.

[Lyudmil Tsvetkov]

<Elephantiasis effect>
Strong pieces lose value in the presence of opponent weaker pieces. And there is no way to relax, for lack of suitable trading partners. The queen's base value is devalued since there ain't any equal trading partners available.

Tell it to the queen about pawns.

Tell her that she lose value in the presence of opponent weak pawns and I guess that "she" is going to laugh.

I think that
Queen d8 and king e8 against king and 8 white pawns is a clear win for the queen assuming the pawns are in ranks 2,3,4.

Can you build a position when the pawns draw?

I also wonder how many pawns in the first half of the board you need to beat a queen(I guess that beating 2 knights and a bishop is easier).

The pawns wins easily here:

[d]1nb1k1n1/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/5K2/8/8 w - - 0 1

those are not just pawns, but quality pawns: advanced pawns, connected pawns.

build the same position with all pawns on ranks 2 or 3, and the minors easily win that.

These quality pawns are going to lose against a queen and I am not sure if the minors win when all the pawns are in the 3th rank

[d]1nb1k1n1/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/5K2/8 w - - 0 1

stockfish believes 1.g4 is equal but did not analyze for a long time.

it would only be natural, as the black pieces start on their home positions, so the white pawns to be placed along the 2nd rank.

[d]1nb1k1n1/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/4K3 w - - 0 1

this is already won for black(but not 3Ns vs same pawns)

the only reason such pawns lose against a queen is that the queen is able to capture couple of them immediately.

[Lyudmil Tsvetkov]

see how much stronger 3 bishops are than 3 knights.

[d]2bbkb2/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/4K3 w - - 0 1

this wins in 5 moves or so

[d]2nnkn2/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/4K3 w - - 0 1

this probably does not win at all

[Uri Blass]

see how much stronger 3 bishops are than 3 knights.

[d]2bbkb2/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/4K3 w - - 0 1

this wins in 5 moves or so

[d]2nnkn2/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/4K3 w - - 0 1

this probably does not win at all

value of 3 bishops is dependent on the square that they stand

This also does not win even if you remove white's pawns

[d]1b1bkb2/8/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/4K3 w - - 0 1