Commercial Release of Ethereal 13.00 (NNUE) for AVX2 Systems

[Modern Times]

Thanks. Its nice to see that Pure lists are back ( At least for FRC ) . That is what I always looked at back in the day. I'de love to see those for each list, and actually have that be the default. Its simply a greater quality list by removing sampling biases

Yes agreed. The pure list never went away on FRC, but there is some sort of bug which means we had to turn them off for the other two lists. I'm trying to fix that for 40/15. One big issue with them is the number of games. Yes you reduce potential bias from testing against multiple versions of the same family, but you increase significantly in some cases the statistical margins of error because of less games.

[AndrewGrant]

I'll make reference to NNUE in the engine notes. Also it needs to be coloured blue now since it is commercial.

Ha, well half the engine is open-source, half is not (as with the training code). Half blue half orange.
Like when I get to v13.25 if I do, if its all search changes Ill just send updates to all users since all the "new stuff" is public anyway.
But If I invest the time to train a new network, and do some magic that I've been discussing with people, then it would be a new product.

Tricky business for lists to categorize

[Modern Times]

Yes a bit of a hybrid, but commercial is commercial regardless of source. Of course up to now all commercial engines I know of have been closed source for obvious reasons ! Oh, I guess FF2 is another hybrid actually.

[AlexChess]

Hi Andy,
thank you for Ethereal-ssse3.exe github just compiled by you!!! https://github.com/AndyGrant/Ethereal/releases

Unluckily on Windows 10 ARM64 it starts fine, but never moves (without crashing) and loses by time. Tried with Arena 3.5.1 and BanksiaGUI 0.45.
No NNUE or Tablebases on my first setting to explain my issue. Suddenly hash tables fall from 36 MB to 0 MB.
On infinite level it works fine.



On the same hardware Ethereal 12.75 official and all others not-AVX not-bm2 work perfectly.

Regards, AlexChess

[AndrewGrant]

Hi Andy,
thank you for Ethereal-ssse3.exe github just compiled by you!!! https://github.com/AndyGrant/Ethereal/releases

Unluckily on Windows 10 it starts fine, but never moves (without crashing) and loses by time. Tried with Arena 3.5.1 AND BanksiaGUI 0.45.
No NNUE or Tablebases on my first setting to explain my issue. Suddenly hash tables fall from 36 MB to 0. On infinite level it works fine.



On the same hardware Ethereal 12.75 official works perfectly.

Regards, AlexChess

Built in the same exact way as 12.75, and you are the first complaint. My guess is it was not installed correctly into the GUI. You can sanity check this by running the program from the command line, and sending "go wtime 10000" and verify that it returns moves. I would be very surprised to find that the compiles are not proper. But perhaps I am wrong and there is some minor change to the makefile that has an impact.

[AlexChess]

Code: Select all

Microsoft Windows [Versione 10.0.21390.1000]
(c) Microsoft Corporation. Tutti i diritti riservati.

C:\Users\alex>"\\Mac\Home\Desktop\SCACCHI\CHESS WINDOWS\Ethereal-ssse3.exe"
go wtime 10000
info depth 1 seldepth 1 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 15 nodes 3 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv a2a3
info depth 2 seldepth 2 multipv 1 score cp 72 time 93 nodes 19 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8h6
info depth 3 seldepth 3 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 171 nodes 63 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8f6 a2a3
bestmove g1f3 ponder g8f6

Thank you for the quick answer.

Only Pedone chess has the exact same issue (stops suddenly with hash 0 but works fine on infinite level, hash included) but all Ethereal engines have always ran perfectly...

[AndrewGrant]

Code: Select all

Microsoft Windows [Versione 10.0.21390.1000]
(c) Microsoft Corporation. Tutti i diritti riservati.

C:\Users\alex>"\\Mac\Home\Desktop\SCACCHI\CHESS WINDOWS\Ethereal-ssse3.exe"
go wtime 10000
info depth 1 seldepth 1 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 15 nodes 3 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv a2a3
info depth 2 seldepth 2 multipv 1 score cp 72 time 93 nodes 19 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8h6
info depth 3 seldepth 3 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 171 nodes 63 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8f6 a2a3
bestmove g1f3 ponder g8f6

Thank you for the quick answer.

Only Pedone chess has the exact same issue (stops suddenly but work fine on infinite level) but all Ethereal engines have always ran perfectly...

Are you emulating something? That might be the worst NPS values I've ever seen. Ethereal does not work under WINE as there is no need if you are on Linux you would compile your own.

[AlexChess]

Code: Select all

Microsoft Windows [Versione 10.0.21390.1000]
(c) Microsoft Corporation. Tutti i diritti riservati.

C:\Users\alex>"\\Mac\Home\Desktop\SCACCHI\CHESS WINDOWS\Ethereal-ssse3.exe"
go wtime 10000
info depth 1 seldepth 1 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 15 nodes 3 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv a2a3
info depth 2 seldepth 2 multipv 1 score cp 72 time 93 nodes 19 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8h6
info depth 3 seldepth 3 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 171 nodes 63 nps 0 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8f6 a2a3
bestmove g1f3 ponder g8f6

Thank you for the quick answer.

Only Pedone chess has the exact same issue (stops suddenly but work fine on infinite level) but all Ethereal engines have always ran perfectly...

Are you emulating something? That might be the worst NPS values I've ever seen. Ethereal does not work under WINE as there is no need if you are on Linux you would compile your own.

Yes, it is under Parallels Desktop for mac M1 and I was running a tournament on BanksiaGUI using all the power. Closed all now
I have also linux, but usually I run all the 3 OS to have all the engines availables.

Code: Select all

"\\Mac\Home\Desktop\SCACCHI\CHESS WINDOWS\Ethereal-ssse3.exe"
go wtime 10000
info depth 1 seldepth 1 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 0 nodes 3 nps 3000 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv a2a3
info depth 2 seldepth 2 multipv 1 score cp 72 time 0 nodes 19 nps 19000 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8h6
info depth 3 seldepth 3 multipv 1 score cp 5 time 0 nodes 63 nps 63000 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8f6 a2a3
info depth 4 seldepth 4 multipv 1 score cp 4 time 0 nodes 111 nps 111000 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv g1f3 g8f6 a2a3 b8c6
info depth 5 seldepth 6 multipv 1 score cp -1 time 15 nodes 371 nps 23000 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv c2c4 b8c6 a2a3 e7e6 g1f3
info depth 6 seldepth 4 multipv 1 score cp 30 time 15 nodes 729 nps 45000 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv c2c4 g8f6 b1c3 b8c6
info depth 7 seldepth 7 multipv 1 score cp 32 time 47 nodes 3343 nps 69000 tbhits 0 hashfull 0 pv c2c4 d7d5 c4d5 g8f6 b1c3 f6d5
info depth 8 seldepth 10 multipv 1 score cp 27 time 62 nodes 7493 nps 118000 tbhits 0 hashfull 2 pv c2c4 e7e6 e2e3 b8c6 g1f3 d7d5 c4d5 e6d5
info depth 9 seldepth 11 multipv 1 score cp 36 time 62 nodes 9955 nps 158000 tbhits 0 hashfull 3 pv c2c4 e7e6 g1f3 g8f6 b1c3 d7d5 c4d5 e6d5 e2e3
info depth 10 seldepth 14 multipv 1 score cp 37 time 78 nodes 15883 nps 201000 tbhits 0 hashfull 4 pv c2c4 g8f6 b1c3 d7d5 d2d4 d5c4 g1f3 c8g4 e2e3 c7c6 f1c4
info depth 11 seldepth 16 multipv 1 score cp 37 time 109 nodes 44084 nps 400000 tbhits 0 hashfull 9 pv d2d4 g8f6 c2c4 d7d5 b1c3 d5c4 g1f3 c8g4 e2e3 c7c6 f1c4
info depth 12 seldepth 17 multipv 1 score cp 30 time 140 nodes 86856 nps 616000 tbhits 0 hashfull 15 pv d2d4 d7d5 g1f3 c8f5 e2e3 g8f6 c2c4 e7e6 b1c3 b8c6 f1e2 d5c4 e2c4
info depth 13 seldepth 23 multipv 1 score cp 29 time 187 nodes 164636 nps 875000 tbhits 0 hashfull 23 pv d2d4 d7d5 g1f3 c8f5 c2c4 e7e6 b1c3 b8c6 c1g5 f7f6 g5f4 c6b4 a1c1 c7c6 d1b3 d5c4 b3c4
info depth 14 seldepth 19 multipv 1 score cp 21 time 281 nodes 307406 nps 1090000 tbhits 0 hashfull 44 pv d2d4 d7d5 g1f3 c8f5 c2c4 e7e6 b1c3 g8f6 c1f4 b8d7 c4d5 e6d5 d1b3
info depth 15 seldepth 24 multipv 1 score cp 19 time 359 nodes 395633 nps 1098000 tbhits 0 hashfull 58 pv d2d4 d7d5 g1f3 c8f5 c2c4 e7e6 b1c3 g8f6 c1g5 c7c6 h2h3 h7h6 g5f6 d8f6 e2e3 a7a6 d1b3
bestmove d2d4 ponder d7d5

[AndrewGrant]

Are you emulating something? That might be the worst NPS values I've ever seen. Ethereal does not work under WINE as there is no need if you are on Linux you would compile your own.

Yes, it is under Parallels Desktop for mac M1 and I was running a tournament on BanksiaGUI using all the power. Closed all now

Now that everything is closed, can you try your GUI again? Ethereal checks the time every 1024 nodes. If you were getting 60 nodes per second, and playing quick games, I can easily see a time loss with no move returned, due to the extremely low speed.

[AlexChess]

Are you emulating something? That might be the worst NPS values I've ever seen. Ethereal does not work under WINE as there is no need if you are on Linux you would compile your own.

Yes, it is under Parallels Desktop for mac M1 and I was running a tournament on BanksiaGUI using all the power. Closed all now

Now that everything is closed, can you try your GUI again? Ethereal checks the time every 1024 nodes. If you were getting 60 nodes per second, and playing quick games, I can easily see a time loss with no move returned, due to the extremely low speed.

Ok, thank you for your patience. On BanksiaGui I was running a blitz with ethereal 12.75
+ Mike Byrne's nn-c4c306d60d95.nnue and it is very strong... 19/32 points against all the best engines, until now!
13.00 after a while stopped thinking without crashing. I have always used Ethereal with it with no problems.