Hi,
I was watching Cfish based engine games. This position happened in one of the games. What are some analysis of it :
[d]k5r1/1pq2p1r/2b1p1n1/p2pP3/2nP3p/PQ1B1NP1/2P2P1R/2B2K1R b - - 3 26
A practical position in a computer game
Moderator: Ras
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Look
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- Full name: Mehdi Amini
A practical position in a computer game
Farewell.
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Ajedrecista
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Re: A practical position in a computer game.
Hello:
SF 16 up to depth 41 thinks that 26.- ..., hxg3 is the only move that draws:
Regards from Spain.
Ajedrecista.
SF 16 up to depth 41 thinks that 26.- ..., hxg3 is the only move that draws:
Code: Select all
FEN: k5r1/1pq2p1r/2b1p1n1/p2pP3/2nP3p/PQ1B1NP1/2P2P1R/2B2K1R b - - 3 26
Stockfish_16-windows-x86-64-modern:
[...]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
40/55 10:50 493.938.134 759.263 -1,43 Rh7h8 g3xh4 Rh8h5 Bc1g5 Ka8a7 Rh2g2 Rg8h8 Kf1g1 Qc7b8 Qb3c3 Qb8f8 Bg5f6 Rh8g8 Nf3e1 Ng6f4 Rg2g3 Rh5f5 Bf6g5 Ka7a6 Ne1g2 Nf4xd3 Qc3xd3 Bc6b5 Qd3d1 f7f6 e5xf6 e6e5 Bg5h6 Qf8f7 Rg3xg8 Qf7xg8 Bh6g7 Qg8e6 h4h5 e5e4 a3a4 Bb5xa4 h5h6 e4e3 f2xe3 Ba4b5 Qd1e1
40/24 10:50 493.938.134 759.263 0,00 h4xg3 Rh2xh7 g3g2+ Kf1xg2 Ng6h4+ Kg2f1 Nh4xf3 Qb3c3 Bc6b5 Kf1e2 Nf3g1+ Ke2e1 Ng1f3+
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
41/55 14:28 655.703.670 754.867 -1,44 Qc7d7 Nf3xh4 Bc6a4 Qb3a2 Rg8h8 Nh4f3 Rh7xh2 Rh1xh2 Rh8xh2 Nf3xh2 Ng6e7 Kf1g2 Ne7c6 Nh2f3 Nc6a7 Qa2a1 Na7b5 Nf3g5 Qd7c7 g3g4 Qc7b6 c2c3 Qb6c7 Kg2g3 Ka8a7 f2f4 Qc7d7 f4f5 e6xf5 g4xf5 Qd7e8 Bd3xc4 d5xc4 Bc1f4 Qe8d7 e5e6 f7xe6 f5f6 Nb5d6 Qa1e1
41/48 14:28 655.703.670 754.867 0,00 h4xg3 Rh2xh7 g3g2+ Kf1xg2 Ng6h4+ Kg2f1 Nh4xf3 Qb3c3 Bc6b5 Kf1e2 Nf3g1+ Ke2e1 Ng1f3+Ajedrecista.
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Eelco de Groot
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Re: A practical position in a computer game
Hello guys, I let Crystal 6 PMT do a search on my old Dell machine, I don't think it has discovered anything that Stockfish has not seen also.
45 203:34 0.00 1...hxg3 2.Txh7 g2+ 3.Kxg2 Ph4+ 4.Kf1 Pxf3 5.Dc3 Lb5 6.Th8 Dc8 7.Txg8 Dxg8 8.Le2 Dg4 9.Dxf3 Pd2+ 10.Lxd2 Dxf3 11.Th8+ Ka7 12.Lxb5 Dxa3 13.Ld3 Da1+ 14.Ke2 a4 (9.570.620.561) 783
45 203:34 +1.58 1...b5 2.Pxh4 b4 3.axb4 a4 4.Db1 Tgh8 5.Kg2 Lb5 6.Th3 Kb7 7.Pxg6 fxg6 8.Lh6 Df7 9.Dc1 De8 10.Th4 Tc7 11.Dg5 Tg8 12.Ta1 Pb2 13.Lxb5 Dxb5 14.c3 Pc4 (9.570.620.561) 783
45 203:34 +1.69 1...Thh8 2.gxh4 Th5 3.Tg2 Ka7 4.Tg3 Dc8 5.Lg5 Tgh8 6.Dc3 Lb5 7.Kg1 Ka6 8.Lf6 Tg8 9.Pe1 Pf4 10.Kh2 Db8 11.Pg2 Pxd3 12.Txg8 Dxg8 13.cxd3 Pb6 14.Pf4 Tf5 (9.570.620.561) 783
45 203:34 +1.84 1...Dd7 2.Pxh4 La4 3.Dc3 Dc6 4.Da1 Db5 5.f3 Th5 6.Kf2 Pe7 7.g4 Thh8 8.Kg3 Db6 9.c3 Ld7 10.Db1 Dc7 11.Kf2 Lc6 12.Pg2 Txh2 13.Txh2 Pg6 14.Th7 Pf8 (9.570.620.561) 783
46 247:11 0.00 1...hxg3 2.Txh7 g2+ 3.Kxg2 Ph4+ 4.Kf1 Pxf3 5.Dc3 Lb5 6.Th8 Dc8 7.Txg8 Dxg8 8.Le2 Dg4 9.Dxf3 Pd2+ 10.Lxd2 Dxf3 11.Th8+ Ka7 12.Lxb5 Dxa3 13.Ld3 Da1+ 14.Ke2 a4 (11.616.071.065) 783
46 247:11 +1.79 1...Dd7 2.Pxh4 La4 3.Dc3 Dc6 4.Da1 Db5 5.f3 Th5 6.Kf2 Pe7 7.g4 Thh8 8.Kg3 Db6 9.c3 Ld7 10.Db1 Dc7 11.Pg2 Txh2 12.Txh2 f6 13.Th7 Lc6 14.Lf4 fxe5 (11.616.071.065) 783
46 247:11 +1.64 1...b5 2.Pxh4 b4 3.axb4 a4 4.Db1 Tgh8 5.Kg2 Lb5 6.Th3 Kb7 7.Pxg6 fxg6 8.Lh6 Df7 9.Th4 De8 10.Dc1 Pb6 11.Dd2 Pc8 12.Lg5 Txh4 13.Lxh4 Pb6 14.Ta1 Th7 (11.616.071.065) 783
46 247:11 +1.73 1...Thh8 2.gxh4 Th5 3.Tg2 Ka7 4.Tg3 b6 5.Lg5 Tgh8 6.Kg1 Dd7 7.Le2 Pe7 8.Pe1 La4 9.Db1 Pf5 10.Lxh5 Pxg3 11.fxg3 Txh5 12.Dc1 Dc8 13.Kf2 Th7 14.Pf3 Df8 (11.616.071.065) 783
45 203:34 0.00 1...hxg3 2.Txh7 g2+ 3.Kxg2 Ph4+ 4.Kf1 Pxf3 5.Dc3 Lb5 6.Th8 Dc8 7.Txg8 Dxg8 8.Le2 Dg4 9.Dxf3 Pd2+ 10.Lxd2 Dxf3 11.Th8+ Ka7 12.Lxb5 Dxa3 13.Ld3 Da1+ 14.Ke2 a4 (9.570.620.561) 783
45 203:34 +1.58 1...b5 2.Pxh4 b4 3.axb4 a4 4.Db1 Tgh8 5.Kg2 Lb5 6.Th3 Kb7 7.Pxg6 fxg6 8.Lh6 Df7 9.Dc1 De8 10.Th4 Tc7 11.Dg5 Tg8 12.Ta1 Pb2 13.Lxb5 Dxb5 14.c3 Pc4 (9.570.620.561) 783
45 203:34 +1.69 1...Thh8 2.gxh4 Th5 3.Tg2 Ka7 4.Tg3 Dc8 5.Lg5 Tgh8 6.Dc3 Lb5 7.Kg1 Ka6 8.Lf6 Tg8 9.Pe1 Pf4 10.Kh2 Db8 11.Pg2 Pxd3 12.Txg8 Dxg8 13.cxd3 Pb6 14.Pf4 Tf5 (9.570.620.561) 783
45 203:34 +1.84 1...Dd7 2.Pxh4 La4 3.Dc3 Dc6 4.Da1 Db5 5.f3 Th5 6.Kf2 Pe7 7.g4 Thh8 8.Kg3 Db6 9.c3 Ld7 10.Db1 Dc7 11.Kf2 Lc6 12.Pg2 Txh2 13.Txh2 Pg6 14.Th7 Pf8 (9.570.620.561) 783
46 247:11 0.00 1...hxg3 2.Txh7 g2+ 3.Kxg2 Ph4+ 4.Kf1 Pxf3 5.Dc3 Lb5 6.Th8 Dc8 7.Txg8 Dxg8 8.Le2 Dg4 9.Dxf3 Pd2+ 10.Lxd2 Dxf3 11.Th8+ Ka7 12.Lxb5 Dxa3 13.Ld3 Da1+ 14.Ke2 a4 (11.616.071.065) 783
46 247:11 +1.79 1...Dd7 2.Pxh4 La4 3.Dc3 Dc6 4.Da1 Db5 5.f3 Th5 6.Kf2 Pe7 7.g4 Thh8 8.Kg3 Db6 9.c3 Ld7 10.Db1 Dc7 11.Pg2 Txh2 12.Txh2 f6 13.Th7 Lc6 14.Lf4 fxe5 (11.616.071.065) 783
46 247:11 +1.64 1...b5 2.Pxh4 b4 3.axb4 a4 4.Db1 Tgh8 5.Kg2 Lb5 6.Th3 Kb7 7.Pxg6 fxg6 8.Lh6 Df7 9.Th4 De8 10.Dc1 Pb6 11.Dd2 Pc8 12.Lg5 Txh4 13.Lxh4 Pb6 14.Ta1 Th7 (11.616.071.065) 783
46 247:11 +1.73 1...Thh8 2.gxh4 Th5 3.Tg2 Ka7 4.Tg3 b6 5.Lg5 Tgh8 6.Kg1 Dd7 7.Le2 Pe7 8.Pe1 La4 9.Db1 Pf5 10.Lxh5 Pxg3 11.fxg3 Txh5 12.Dc1 Dc8 13.Kf2 Th7 14.Pf3 Df8 (11.616.071.065) 783
Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
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Look
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- Full name: Mehdi Amini
Re: A practical position in a computer game
Can you find a win for white in this endgame:
[d]8/5k2/6p1/4b2p/2R5/7P/5KP1/8 w - - 1 68
[d]8/5k2/6p1/4b2p/2R5/7P/5KP1/8 w - - 1 68
Farewell.
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Eelco de Groot
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- Full name: Eelco de Groot
Re: A practical position in a computer game
I have no idea, sorry did not try because
a) I don't know the theory, or context of your question Mehdi.
b) I have no tablebases installed, apart from Shredder basic bases that come with the GUI.
c) Only an old Dell machine.
d) Surely this is covered somewhere already. Nunn? Cheron?
e) It looked very drawish to my eyes but I don't think I ever played this on a real chessboard.
f) It doesn't have Alfils, or dragons, elephants, legions, Hannibal, or magicians, camels, ducks etc. Also, it is not Go
a) I don't know the theory, or context of your question Mehdi.
b) I have no tablebases installed, apart from Shredder basic bases that come with the GUI.
c) Only an old Dell machine.
d) Surely this is covered somewhere already. Nunn? Cheron?
e) It looked very drawish to my eyes but I don't think I ever played this on a real chessboard.
f) It doesn't have Alfils, or dragons, elephants, legions, Hannibal, or magicians, camels, ducks etc. Also, it is not Go
Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
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Jouni
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- Full name: Jouni Uski
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Look
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- Full name: Mehdi Amini
Re: A practical position in a computer game
A new position:
[d]r1bq1k2/1pn1p2p/p1n2pp1/2Pp4/2B5/5N1P/P2Q1PP1/R2R2K1 b - - 1 18
[d]r1bq1k2/1pn1p2p/p1n2pp1/2Pp4/2B5/5N1P/P2Q1PP1/R2R2K1 b - - 1 18
Farewell.
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Eelco de Groot
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- Full name: Eelco de Groot
Re: A practical position in a computer game
Some output from Rebel EAS. I discovered that Rebel EAS does have an exclusion search in Shredder GUI contrary to what I posted on ProDeo but does it not the way I first expected so I thought it was not functioning.
'Volgende Zet Analyseren' en 'Volgende zet negeren' doen niet gelijk wat ik verwachtte maar ik doe het mogelijk verkeerd, ik gebruik dit anders nooit. Maar 'Volgende Beste Zet' deed wel wat ik verwachtte! Dus het is goed bruikbaar zo als je geen Multi PV hebt. Sorry, this was in Dutch..
I skipped 2.Rab1, Rebels first choice and did the exclusion search for the next move Bb3.
[pgn] [Event "?"] [Site "?"] [Date "2024.01.06"] [Round "?"] [White "?"] [Black "?"] [Result "*"] [SetUp "1"] [FEN "r1bq1k2/1pn1p2p/p1n2pp1/2Pp4/2B5/5N1P/P2Q1PP1/R2R2K1 b - -"] 1... e6 2. Bb3 {0.00/43 289:01m} Qe7 3. Rab1 Qxc5 4. Rdc1 Qd6 5. Qh6+ Kg8 6. h4 Qf8 7. Qe3 e5 8. Ba4 Nb5 9. Bxb5 axb5 10. Rxb5 d4 11. Qb3+ Qf7 12. Nd2 Be6 13. Qb1 Bf5 14. Qb3 Be6 * [/pgn]
I copied the PV from depth 39 to a pgn, see above
This was the output of the exclusion search in Shredder:
Negeren Ta1-b1 ...
18/35 0:01 0.00++ 2.Lb3 (1.499.222)
18/41 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.526.775)
19/29 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.534.534)
20/34 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.548.838)
21/32 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.562.601)
22/37 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.579.359)
23/38 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.598.720)
24/34 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.623.039)
25/34 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.659.611)
26/36 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.719.225)
27/45 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.783.246)
28/45 0:02 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.853.213)
29/48 0:03 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (2.665.442)
30/48 0:03 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (2.979.282)
31/41 0:03 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (3.248.752)
32/44 0:04 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (3.778.770)
33/52 0:14 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (11.241.580)
34/51 0:27 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (20.549.637)
35/50 1:14 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (55.253.681)
36/58 3:17 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (142.848.033)
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 1
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 1
37/62 8:20 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (352.914.008)
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 3
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 3
38/62 14:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (586.565.971)
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 4
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 4
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 4
39/70 22:22 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (922.269.681)
If I now go to move 13...Bf5 (after inserting the PV at this point into the game, well the game consisting of PV really, that this is possible I only discovered, after many years, that Shredder can do that..) the output, still in Analysis Mode from Rebel. is then atypical, because it does show a high depth etc , but does not calculate a new PV after the first move 14.Qb3. This is not what you would expect it is not strictly a bug I suppose but a bit unexpected:
[d]r5k1/1p3q1p/2n2pp1/1R2pb2/3p3P/8/P2N1PP1/1QR3K1 w - - Engine: Rebel EAS Chess-System-Tal-2.00 (512 MB)
gemaakt door Ed Schröder, Chris Whittington (C) 2003
31/32 0:02 0.00 14.Db3 (1.990.823)
32/40 0:04 0.00 14.Db3 (3.187.316)
33/38 0:09 0.00 14.Db3 (5.801.965)
34/45 0:23 0.00 14.Db3 (14.787.060)
35/49 0:42 0.00 14.Db3 (26.113.987)
36/50 1:20 0.00 14.Db3 (48.852.056)
37/52 5:26 0.00 14.Db3 (193.112.792)
38/55 7:33 0.00 14.Db3 (266.336.403)
39/51 10:12 0.00 14.Db3 (354.965.518)
40/61 15:26 0.00 14.Db3 (531.851.481)
beste zet: Db1-b3 tijd: 17:31.109 min nodes: 531.851.481
(All this with one thread. I am doing some troubleshooting for an unrelated post from Peter Berger in the Pro Deo forum who is using Rebel EAS in Chessbase with four threads. I think Rebel can actually only do two threads when you set it to four but not 100% sure. Chris does not recommend more than one thread for his program he posted in the past.)
'Volgende Zet Analyseren' en 'Volgende zet negeren' doen niet gelijk wat ik verwachtte maar ik doe het mogelijk verkeerd, ik gebruik dit anders nooit. Maar 'Volgende Beste Zet' deed wel wat ik verwachtte! Dus het is goed bruikbaar zo als je geen Multi PV hebt. Sorry, this was in Dutch..
I skipped 2.Rab1, Rebels first choice and did the exclusion search for the next move Bb3.
[pgn] [Event "?"] [Site "?"] [Date "2024.01.06"] [Round "?"] [White "?"] [Black "?"] [Result "*"] [SetUp "1"] [FEN "r1bq1k2/1pn1p2p/p1n2pp1/2Pp4/2B5/5N1P/P2Q1PP1/R2R2K1 b - -"] 1... e6 2. Bb3 {0.00/43 289:01m} Qe7 3. Rab1 Qxc5 4. Rdc1 Qd6 5. Qh6+ Kg8 6. h4 Qf8 7. Qe3 e5 8. Ba4 Nb5 9. Bxb5 axb5 10. Rxb5 d4 11. Qb3+ Qf7 12. Nd2 Be6 13. Qb1 Bf5 14. Qb3 Be6 * [/pgn]
I copied the PV from depth 39 to a pgn, see above
This was the output of the exclusion search in Shredder:
Negeren Ta1-b1 ...
18/35 0:01 0.00++ 2.Lb3 (1.499.222)
18/41 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.526.775)
19/29 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.534.534)
20/34 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.548.838)
21/32 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.562.601)
22/37 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.579.359)
23/38 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.598.720)
24/34 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.623.039)
25/34 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.659.611)
26/36 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.719.225)
27/45 0:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.783.246)
28/45 0:02 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (1.853.213)
29/48 0:03 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (2.665.442)
30/48 0:03 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (2.979.282)
31/41 0:03 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (3.248.752)
32/44 0:04 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (3.778.770)
33/52 0:14 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (11.241.580)
34/51 0:27 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (20.549.637)
35/50 1:14 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (55.253.681)
36/58 3:17 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (142.848.033)
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 1
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 1
37/62 8:20 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (352.914.008)
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 3
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 3
38/62 14:01 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (586.565.971)
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 4
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 4
currmove c4b3 d8e7 currmovenumber 1 4
39/70 22:22 0.00 2.Lb3 De7 3.Tab1 Dxc5 4.Tdc1 Dd6 5.Dh6+ Kg8 6.h4 Df8 7.De3 e5 8.La4 Pb5 9.Lxb5 axb5 10.Txb5 d4 11.Db3+ Df7 12.Pd2 Le6 13.Db1 Lf5 14.Db3 (922.269.681)
If I now go to move 13...Bf5 (after inserting the PV at this point into the game, well the game consisting of PV really, that this is possible I only discovered, after many years, that Shredder can do that..) the output, still in Analysis Mode from Rebel. is then atypical, because it does show a high depth etc , but does not calculate a new PV after the first move 14.Qb3. This is not what you would expect it is not strictly a bug I suppose but a bit unexpected:
[d]r5k1/1p3q1p/2n2pp1/1R2pb2/3p3P/8/P2N1PP1/1QR3K1 w - - Engine: Rebel EAS Chess-System-Tal-2.00 (512 MB)
gemaakt door Ed Schröder, Chris Whittington (C) 2003
31/32 0:02 0.00 14.Db3 (1.990.823)
32/40 0:04 0.00 14.Db3 (3.187.316)
33/38 0:09 0.00 14.Db3 (5.801.965)
34/45 0:23 0.00 14.Db3 (14.787.060)
35/49 0:42 0.00 14.Db3 (26.113.987)
36/50 1:20 0.00 14.Db3 (48.852.056)
37/52 5:26 0.00 14.Db3 (193.112.792)
38/55 7:33 0.00 14.Db3 (266.336.403)
39/51 10:12 0.00 14.Db3 (354.965.518)
40/61 15:26 0.00 14.Db3 (531.851.481)
beste zet: Db1-b3 tijd: 17:31.109 min nodes: 531.851.481
(All this with one thread. I am doing some troubleshooting for an unrelated post from Peter Berger in the Pro Deo forum who is using Rebel EAS in Chessbase with four threads. I think Rebel can actually only do two threads when you set it to four but not 100% sure. Chris does not recommend more than one thread for his program he posted in the past.)
Last edited by Eelco de Groot on Sat Jan 06, 2024 4:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
-
Eelco de Groot
- Posts: 4702
- Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2006 2:40 am
- Full name: Eelco de Groot
Re: A practical position in a computer game
Same position, Crystal 7, four best moves, max 45 minutes analysis in ChessX:
0.00 [+] [*] 18... e6 19. Bb3 Qe7 20. Qe3 a5 21. Nd4 a4 22. Nxc6 bxc6 23. Bc2 e5 24. Rab1 Kg7 25. Rb4 Be6 26. Rxa4 d4 27. Qd2 Rxa4 28. Bxa4 Nd5 29. Rc1 Nc3 30. Rxc3 dxc3 31. Qxc3 Qb7 32. Bb3 Bxb3 33. axb3 Qd7 34. Qb4 h5 35. Qe4 Qd1+ 36. Kh2 Qd2 37. Qxc6 Qf4+ 38. Kh1 Qc1+ 39. Kh2 (depth 41, 0:45:00)
+0.33 [+] [*] 18... Kg7 19. Bxd5 Nxd5 20. Qxd5 Qxd5 21. Rxd5 Be6 22. Rd2 Rc8 23. Rb1 Rc7 24. Kh2 h5 25. Rc1 Kf7 26. Rc3 Nb4 27. a3 Nc6 28. h4 Na5 29. Nd4 Bc4 30. Nc2 Rxc5 31. f3 Ke8 32. Nb4 Rc7 33. Kg1 Rc8 34. Rdc2 Kf7 35. Rc1 Rc5 36. Kf2 Rc8 37. Rd1 Ke8 38. g4 hxg4 39. fxg4 Kf7 40. Rd7 Rc5 41. Nd3 Rb5 42. Rd4 Bxd3 43. Rcxd3 (depth 41, 0:45:00)
+0.42 [+] [*] 18... Qd7 19. Bxd5 Nxd5 20. Qxd5 Qxd5 21. Rxd5 Be6 22. Rdd1 Rc8 23. Rab1 Rc7 24. a3 Bd7 25. Nd4 Kf7 26. h4 Na5 27. Rdc1 e5 28. Ne2 Bc6 29. f3 Rd7 30. Rd1 Rxd1+ 31. Rxd1 Nb3 32. Rd8 Nxc5 33. Nc1 h5 34. Rc8 Ke7 35. Kf2 a5 36. Ra8 a4 37. Na2 Nd3+ 38. Ke3 Ne1 39. Nb4 Nxg2+ 40. Kf2 Nxh4 41. Nxc6+ bxc6 42. Rxa4 g5 43. Ra7+ Kd6 (depth 41, 0:45:00)
+0.39 [+] [*] 18... Kg8 19. Bxd5+ Qxd5 20. Qxd5+ Nxd5 21. Rxd5 Be6 22. Rd2 Rc8 23. Rb1 Rc7 24. a3 Bd7 25. Nd4 Kf7 26. Nxc6 Bxc6 27. h4 Rc8 28. f3 h5 29. Kf2 Rg8 30. Rbd1 Ba4 31. Rg1 g5 32. g4 hxg4 33. Rxg4 Bb5 34. hxg5 Rxg5 35. Rxg5 fxg5 36. Kg3 Kf6 37. Kg4 Bc6 38. Rd8 Ke5 39. Rg8 Kd4 40. Rxg5 e6 41. f4 Bd5 (depth 40, 0:39:12)
[+] 18... e6 (suggested move)
Complexity: 0.56/0.56
pgn of this PV in ChessX:
[pgn][Event ""] [Site ""] [Date ""] [Round ""] [White ""] [Black ""] [Result ""] [FEN "r1bq1k2/1pn1p2p/p1n2pp1/2Pp4/2B5/5N1P/P2Q1PP1/R2R2K1 b - - 1 18"] [SetUp "1"] 18... e6 19. Bb3 Qe7 20. Qe3 a5 21. Nd4 a4 22. Nxc6 bxc6 23. Bc2 e5 24. Rab1 Kg7 25. Rb4 Be6 26. Rxa4 d4 27. Qd2 Rxa4 28. Bxa4 Nd5 29. Rc1 Nc3 30. Rxc3 dxc3 31. Qxc3 Qb7 32. Bb3 Bxb3 33. axb3 Qd7 34. Qb4 h5 35. Qe4 Qd1+ 36. Kh2 Qd2 37. Qxc6 Qf4+ 38. Kh1 Qc1+ 39. Kh2 { [%eval 0.00]} [/pgn]
0.00 [+] [*] 18... e6 19. Bb3 Qe7 20. Qe3 a5 21. Nd4 a4 22. Nxc6 bxc6 23. Bc2 e5 24. Rab1 Kg7 25. Rb4 Be6 26. Rxa4 d4 27. Qd2 Rxa4 28. Bxa4 Nd5 29. Rc1 Nc3 30. Rxc3 dxc3 31. Qxc3 Qb7 32. Bb3 Bxb3 33. axb3 Qd7 34. Qb4 h5 35. Qe4 Qd1+ 36. Kh2 Qd2 37. Qxc6 Qf4+ 38. Kh1 Qc1+ 39. Kh2 (depth 41, 0:45:00)
+0.33 [+] [*] 18... Kg7 19. Bxd5 Nxd5 20. Qxd5 Qxd5 21. Rxd5 Be6 22. Rd2 Rc8 23. Rb1 Rc7 24. Kh2 h5 25. Rc1 Kf7 26. Rc3 Nb4 27. a3 Nc6 28. h4 Na5 29. Nd4 Bc4 30. Nc2 Rxc5 31. f3 Ke8 32. Nb4 Rc7 33. Kg1 Rc8 34. Rdc2 Kf7 35. Rc1 Rc5 36. Kf2 Rc8 37. Rd1 Ke8 38. g4 hxg4 39. fxg4 Kf7 40. Rd7 Rc5 41. Nd3 Rb5 42. Rd4 Bxd3 43. Rcxd3 (depth 41, 0:45:00)
+0.42 [+] [*] 18... Qd7 19. Bxd5 Nxd5 20. Qxd5 Qxd5 21. Rxd5 Be6 22. Rdd1 Rc8 23. Rab1 Rc7 24. a3 Bd7 25. Nd4 Kf7 26. h4 Na5 27. Rdc1 e5 28. Ne2 Bc6 29. f3 Rd7 30. Rd1 Rxd1+ 31. Rxd1 Nb3 32. Rd8 Nxc5 33. Nc1 h5 34. Rc8 Ke7 35. Kf2 a5 36. Ra8 a4 37. Na2 Nd3+ 38. Ke3 Ne1 39. Nb4 Nxg2+ 40. Kf2 Nxh4 41. Nxc6+ bxc6 42. Rxa4 g5 43. Ra7+ Kd6 (depth 41, 0:45:00)
+0.39 [+] [*] 18... Kg8 19. Bxd5+ Qxd5 20. Qxd5+ Nxd5 21. Rxd5 Be6 22. Rd2 Rc8 23. Rb1 Rc7 24. a3 Bd7 25. Nd4 Kf7 26. Nxc6 Bxc6 27. h4 Rc8 28. f3 h5 29. Kf2 Rg8 30. Rbd1 Ba4 31. Rg1 g5 32. g4 hxg4 33. Rxg4 Bb5 34. hxg5 Rxg5 35. Rxg5 fxg5 36. Kg3 Kf6 37. Kg4 Bc6 38. Rd8 Ke5 39. Rg8 Kd4 40. Rxg5 e6 41. f4 Bd5 (depth 40, 0:39:12)
[+] 18... e6 (suggested move)
Complexity: 0.56/0.56
pgn of this PV in ChessX:
[pgn][Event ""] [Site ""] [Date ""] [Round ""] [White ""] [Black ""] [Result ""] [FEN "r1bq1k2/1pn1p2p/p1n2pp1/2Pp4/2B5/5N1P/P2Q1PP1/R2R2K1 b - - 1 18"] [SetUp "1"] 18... e6 19. Bb3 Qe7 20. Qe3 a5 21. Nd4 a4 22. Nxc6 bxc6 23. Bc2 e5 24. Rab1 Kg7 25. Rb4 Be6 26. Rxa4 d4 27. Qd2 Rxa4 28. Bxa4 Nd5 29. Rc1 Nc3 30. Rxc3 dxc3 31. Qxc3 Qb7 32. Bb3 Bxb3 33. axb3 Qd7 34. Qb4 h5 35. Qe4 Qd1+ 36. Kh2 Qd2 37. Qxc6 Qf4+ 38. Kh1 Qc1+ 39. Kh2 { [%eval 0.00]} [/pgn]
Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
place. Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you
are, by definition, not smart enough to debug it.
-- Brian W. Kernighan
-
peter
- Posts: 3553
- Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 7:38 am
- Full name: Peter Martan
Re: A practical position in a computer game
SF and Lc0 both agree with drawing that after a few moves with reversed colours and medium (of 3) setting ("late" compared to "never" and "early") of Fritz GUI as for draw- adjudication.
SF with 30 threads of 16x3.5GHz CPU, Lc0 with 3070ti Nvidia GPU and net BT3 2860M:
[pgn][Event "AMD, Schnellschach 45.0min+15.0sek"] [Site "AMD"] [Date "2024.01.06"] [Round "2"] [White "Stockfish"] [Black "Lc0 v0.31.0-dag+git.a4877961"] [Result "1/2-1/2"] [Annotator "0.00;0.09"] [SetUp "1"] [FEN "r1bq1k2/1pn1p2p/p1n2pp1/2Pp4/2B5/5N1P/P2Q1PP1/R2R2K1 b - - 0 18"] [PlyCount "13"] [TimeControl "2700+15"] {AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16-Core Processor 3400 MHz W=60.2 plies; 14.112kN/s; 133.069 TBAs B=26.0 plies; 12kN/s; 5 TBAs 0.11;0.00: 'AMD Ryzen 9 5950X 16-Core Processor 3400 MHz W=33.6 plies; 13kN/s; 329 TBAs B=62.6 plies; 13.231kN/s; 1.029.731 TBAs '} 18... e6 {0.00/66 119 Beide letzter Buchzug} 19. Rab1 {0.00/60 113} (19. Bb3 {0.11/18 132} Qe7 {0.00/53 0} 20. Rab1 {0.12/19 59} Qxc5 {0.00/54 26 (Kg7)} 21. Rdc1 {0.18/29 50} Qd6 {0.00/54 56} 22. Ba4 {0.19/32 12} b5 {0.00/76 98} 23. Qc3 {0.14/38 0} Ne8 {0.00/67 69} 24. Qxc6 {0.09/34 1} Qxc6 {0.00/64 179} 25. Rxc6 {0.04/34 0;½-½ Lc0 v0.31.0-dag+git.a4877961-Stockfish AMD, Schnellschach 45.0min+15.0sek (1) Remis angenommen}) 19... Kg7 {0.09/20 162 (De7)} 20. Bb3 {0.00/60 49} Qe7 {0.08/23 0} 21. Ba4 {0.00/60 47 (De3)} e5 {0.04/26 55} 22. Qe1 {0.00/51 8} a5 {0.03/26 43 (Ta7)} 23. Nd4 {0.00/69 53} Nxd4 {0.03/28 17} 24. Rxd4 {0.00/61 35} Qxc5 {0.02/29 1 Remis angenommen} 1/2-1/2 [/pgn]
Peter.