Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Discussion of anything and everything relating to chess playing software and machines.

Moderator: Ras

Edward German

Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by Edward German »

PGN:

[Event "Wertungspartie, 5m + 0s"]
[Site "Maschinenraum"]
[Date "2008.03.11"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Nvv777Fritz, Rybka 2.3.2a mp"]
[Black "Wolkenlos, Toga II 3.1.3SE MP"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "B22"]
[WhiteElo "2564"]
[BlackElo "2551"]
[Annotator "-0.07;0.11"]
[PlyCount "96"]
[EventDate "2008.03.11"]
[TimeControl "300"]

{Rybka 2.3.2a mp: 17.3 ply; 211kN/s Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU 6320 @ 1.
86GHz 1867MHz, (2 threads), MyBig.ctg, à_[} 1. e4 {B/0 0} c5 {B/0 0} 2. c3 {
B/0 0} Nf6 {B/0 0} 3. e5 {B/0 0} Nd5 {B/0 0} 4. d4 {B/0 0} cxd4 {B/0 0} 5. Qxd4
{B/0 0} e6 {B/0 0} 6. Nf3 {B/0 0} Nc6 {B/0 0} 7. Qe4 {B/0 0} d6 {B/0 0} 8. Nbd2
{B/0 0} dxe5 {B/0 0} 9. Nxe5 {B/0 0} Nxe5 {B/0 0} 10. Qxe5 {B/0 0} Qd6 {B/0 0}
11. Bb5+ {B/0 0} Bd7 {B/0 0} 12. Bxd7+ {B/0 0} Qxd7 {B/0 0} 13. O-O {B/0 0} Qc7
{B/0 0} 14. Qe2 {B/0 0} Bd6 {B/0 0} 15. Nf3 {B/0 0} Rc8 {B/0 0} 16. g3 {B/0 0}
O-O {B/0 0} 17. Nd4 {B/0 0} Qc5 {B/0 0} 18. Be3 {B/0 0} Nxe3 {B/0 0} 19. Qxe3 {
B/0 0} Rfd8 {B/0 0} 20. Rfd1 {B/0 0} Be7 {B/0 0} 21. Rd3 {-0.07/13 9} Qb6 {
(Ôd5) B/0 0} 22. b3 {-0.03/14 7} Rd6 {(Ëc5) B/0 0} 23. Rad1 {0.00/13 2} Rcd8 {
B/0 0} 24. Qe4 {0.00/14 7} g6 {B/0 0} 25. Nf3 {0.00/14 6} Rxd3 {B/0 0} 26. Rxd3
{0.00/15 2} Rxd3 {B/0 0} 27. Qxd3 {0.00/16 4} Qd6 {(Ôa5) B/0 0} 28. Qe4 {
0.01/15 6} Qd5 {(Ôa6) B/0 0} 29. Qxd5 {0.07/16 2} exd5 {B/0 0} 30. Nd4 {
0.04/18 7} Bc5 {B/0 0} 31. Nc2 {0.05/17 1} b5 {(Kðg7) 0.11/17 10} 32. Kf1 {
0.08/15 2} Kf8 {(f5) 0.10/19 8} 33. Nb4 {(Ke2) 0.37/18 6} Bxb4 {-0.18/17 8} 34.
cxb4 {0.27/21 3} Ke7 {-0.12/19 0} 35. f4 {(Ke2) 0.00/20 23} Kf6 {
(Kðd6) -0.37/18 15} 36. Ke2 {-0.19/19 6} g5 {(Kðf5) -0.52/19 1} 37. Ke3 {
0.15/19 13} gxf4+ {-0.41/19 8} 38. Kxf4 {-2.10/24 28} h5 {-1.00/22 0} 39. h3 {
-2.10/23 4} Ke6 {-1.19/21 5} 40. g4 {(a3) -2.42/23 2} hxg4 {-1.51/19 7} 41.
hxg4 {-5.08/25 20} Kf6 {-1.54/23 0} 42. a3 {-5.35/23 24} d4 {-1.98/21 0} 43. a4
{-5.67/21 18} d3 {-6.89/21 0} 44. Ke3 {-5.77/20 9} Kg5 {-7.74/24 0} 45. Kxd3 {
-5.72/19 2} Kxg4 {-7.94/21 3} 46. Ke3 {-6.57/19 8} a6 {-7.94/21 0} 47. axb5 {
(Kf2) -8.10/15 10} axb5 {-8.40/13 9} 48. Kf2 {(Kd3) -10.84/15 0} f6 {
(Kðf4) Nvv777Fritz,Rybka 2.3.2a mp ñäàåòñÿ -8.87/14 9} 0-1

Nvv777Fritz,R - Wolkenlos,T, Wertungspartie, 5m + 0s 2008

[d]5k2/p4p1p/6p1/1pbp4/8/1PP3P1/P1N2P1P/5K2 w - - 0 1

Rybka 2.3.2a MP played 33. Nb4?? and lost instantly!

Analysis by Rybka 2.3.2 mp 32-bit :

33.Sb4 Lxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Ke6 36.Kd3 g5 37.Kd4 g4 38.a4 Kd6 39.Ke3 a6
= (0.16) Tiefe: 22 00:00:28 7273kN
33.Sb4 Lxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Ke6 36.Kd3 g5 37.Kd4 g4 38.Kc5 f6 39.Kxb5 Kd6
= (0.00) Tiefe: 23 00:01:03 16100kN
33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.Sb4 Kd6 37.Sd3 Ke6 38.Se5 Lh2 39.Sc6 Lxg3
= (0.08) Tiefe: 23 00:03:41 50066kN

(Nemeth, Privat 11.03.2008)

On my Core 2 Duo 2.66 GHz Rybka 2.3.2a MP need 3:41 Minutes, to play an another move! :(
Top
Tony Thomas

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by Tony Thomas »

Looks to me like Rybka only reached depth 6??
Top
User avatar
AdminX
Posts: 6363
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2006 2:34 pm
Location: Acworth, GA

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by AdminX »

Tony Thomas wrote:Looks to me like Rybka only reached depth 6??


Even at deeper depth not any better ...

Analysis by Rybka 2.3.2a mp :

33.Ke2 Ke7 34.h3 Kd6 35.f4 h5 36.Kd3 Bf2 37.g4 a5 38.gxh5
= (0.14) Depth: 5 00:00:00
= (0.04) Depth: 14 00:00:02 393kN
33.Nb4 Bxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Ke6 36.Ke3 g5 37.Kd4 g4 38.Kc5 f6 39.Kxb5 Kd6
= (0.14) Depth: 14 00:00:02 430kN
= (0.11) Depth: 22 00:00:40 6938kN

But if it had a little more time ...

Analysis by Rybka 2.3.2a mp :

33.Ke2 Ke7 34.h3 Kd6 35.f4 h5 36.Kd3 Bf2 37.g4 a5 38.gxh5
= (0.14) Depth: 5 00:00:00
= (0.04) Depth: 14 00:00:02 393kN
33.Nb4 Bxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Ke6 36.Ke3 g5 37.Kd4 g4 38.Kc5 h6 39.Kxb5 Kd6
= (0.14) Depth: 14 00:00:02 430kN
= (0.06) Depth: 23 00:01:26 14790kN
33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 f5 35.Ne1 a5 36.Nf3 b4 37.Kd3 Bf2 38.Ng5 h6 39.Nf3 Ke6
= (0.08) Depth: 23 00:03:30 33010kN
= (0.08) Depth: 23 00:03:30 33010kN
Last edited by AdminX on Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:25 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Good decisions come from experience, and experience comes from bad decisions."
__________________________________________________________________
Ted Summers
Top
Edward German

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by Edward German »

Tony Thomas wrote:Looks to me like Rybka only reached depth 6??
No!

"33. Nb4 {(Ke2) 0.37/18 6}" is Depth 18, +0.37 after 6 seconds (no depth).

But see my Analysis, move 33. And please use the PGN for your analysis, no FEN (FEN is not enough).
Top
perejaslav
Posts: 240
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:01 am
Location: Cold

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by perejaslav »

5k2/p4p1p/6p1/1pbp4/8/1PP3P1/P1N2P1P/5K2 w - - 0 1

Analysis by Rybka 2.3.2a mp x64:

1.Nb4 Bxb4 2.cxb4 Ke7 3.Ke2 Ke6 4.Kd3 g5 5.Kd4 g4 6.Kc5 f5 7.Kxb5 Kd6
= (0.00) 23 00:00:22
1.Ke2 Ke7 2.f4 h5 3.h3 Bg1 4.g4 hxg4 5.hxg4 Kd6 6.Kd3 a5 7.b4 a4
= (0.06) 23 00:03:19
1.Ke2 Ke7 2.f4 h5 3.h3 Bg1 4.g4 hxg4 5.hxg4 Kd6 6.Kd3 a5 7.b4 a4
= (0.05) 24 00:03:41

After long thinking Rybka moves finally Ke2
Top
User avatar
Mike S.
Posts: 1480
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 5:33 am

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by Mike S. »

In such cases, multi-pv is useful to see if Nb4 gets a clearly worse eval after while, or if the decision for Ke2 is based on a difference of 0.0x only.

Engine: Rybka 2.3.2a 32-bit (single, D945 3.4 GHz, 256 MB hash):
von Vasik Rajlich
displaying 2 variations
-----
12 0:01 +0.08 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f3 Kd6 35.Kd3 Lg1 36.h3 Lf2 37.Sd4 (88.567) 71.5
LT: 11 0:00 +0.11 33.f3 Ke7 34.Ke2 a5 35.Kd3 Lg1 36.h3 Lf2 (40.595) 60.3
(...)

There are several switches between Sb4(=Nb4) and Ke2 at depths <17.

(...)
17 0:25 +0.15 33.Sb4 d4 34.Sa6 Lb6 35.cxd4 Lxd4 36.Ke2 Le5 37.Sb4 Ld6 38.Sc6 a6 39.Kd3 Ke8 (1.809.191) 71.7
17 0:23 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f3 Kd6 35.f4 h5 36.h3 Lg1 37.g4 hxg4 38.hxg4 a5 39.Kd3 Lh2 (1.684.350) 72.3
-----
18 0:30 +0.34 33.Sb4 Lxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Kd6 36.Kd3 g5 37.f4 g4 38.Kd4 a6 39.f5 f6 (2.167.295) 73.9
LT: 17 0:23 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f3 Kd6 35.f4 h5 36.h3 Lg1 37.g4 hxg4 38.hxg4 a5 39.Kd3 Lh2 (1.684.350) 72.3
(...)
22 3:03 +0.25 33.Sb4 Lxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Kd6 36.Ke3 g5 37.a4 a6 38.f3 f6 39.Kd4 f5 (14.251.028) 79.6
22 3:34 +0.10 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 f6 35.g4 g5 36.h3 Kd6 37.Kf3 a6 38.b4 Lb6 39.Sd4 Ke7 (16.338.011) 77.9
-----
23 4:40 0.00 33.Sb4 Lxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Ke6 36.Kd3 g5 37.Kd4 g4 38.Kc5 Ke5 39.Kxb5 Kd6 (22.230.037) 81.0
LT: 22 3:34 +0.10 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 f6 35.g4 g5 36.h3 Kd6 37.Kf3 a6 38.b4 Lb6 39.Sd4 Ke7 (16.338.011) 77.9
-----
23 6:38 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.Se3 Kd6 37.a3 a5 38.b4 a4 39.Sc2 Kc7 (31.516.921) 80.9
23 4:40 0.00 33.Sb4 Lxb4 34.cxb4 Ke7 35.Ke2 Ke6 36.Kd3 g5 37.Kd4 g4 38.Kc5 Ke5 39.Kxb5 Kd6 (22.230.037) 81.0
-----
23 6:38 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.Se3 Kd6 37.a3 a5 38.b4 a4 39.Sc2 Kc7 (31.516.921) 80.9
23 7:13 +0.09 33.f4 Ke7 34.Ke2 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.Se3 Kd6 37.a3 a5 38.b4 a4 39.Sc2 Kc7 (33.534.994) 79.2
-----
24 9:22 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.g4 hxg4 37.hxg4 Kd7 38.Kd3 a5 39.b4 a4 (43.493.315) 79.1
LT: 23 7:13 +0.09 33.f4 Ke7 34.Ke2 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.Se3 Kd6 37.a3 a5 38.b4 a4 39.Sc2 Kc7 (33.534.994) 79.2
-----
24 9:22 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.g4 hxg4 37.hxg4 Kd7 38.Kd3 a5 39.b4 a4 (43.493.315) 79.1
24 9:47 +0.09 33.f4 Ke7 34.Ke2 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.g4 hxg4 37.hxg4 Kd7 38.Kd3 a5 39.b4 a4 (45.049.620) 78.5
Bester Zug: Kf1-e2 Zeit: 9:53.032 min K/s: 78.785 Knoten: 45.627.099

So, at least up to depth 23, Nb4 is not considered a big mistake yet and the difference to Ke2 is only 0.09. - I should have used more variations, to see which eval Nb4 gets at depths of 24+, but that takes very long on my computer.
Regards, Mike
Top
User avatar
Ovyron
Posts: 4562
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 4:30 am

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by Ovyron »

Mike S. wrote: 24 9:22 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.g4 hxg4 37.hxg4 Kd7 38.Kd3 a5 39.b4 a4 (43.493.315) 79.1
LT: 23 7:13 +0.09 33.f4 Ke7 34.Ke2 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.Se3 Kd6 37.a3 a5 38.b4 a4 39.Sc2 Kc7 (33.534.994) 79.2
-----
24 9:22 +0.09 33.Ke2 Ke7 34.f4 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.g4 hxg4 37.hxg4 Kd7 38.Kd3 a5 39.b4 a4 (43.493.315) 79.1
24 9:47 +0.09 33.f4 Ke7 34.Ke2 h5 35.h3 Lg1 36.g4 hxg4 37.hxg4 Kd7 38.Kd3 a5 39.b4 a4 (45.049.620) 78.5
Bester Zug: Kf1-e2 Zeit: 9:53.032 min K/s: 78.785 Knoten: 45.627.099
I'm going offtopic: How do you make that the old lines of Multi-PV aren't replaced with new ones like in your post? It could prove very useful.
Top
User avatar
Mike S.
Posts: 1480
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 5:33 am

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by Mike S. »

Ovyron wrote:How do you make that the old lines of Multi-PV aren't replaced with new ones like in your post?
This output is from my Shredder interface (version 5), which is an older "Shredder Classic" GUI.

I think Arena keeps all multi-pv lines, too. - If I provide multi-pv output from Fritz, I usually add the last (finished) depth, manually.
Regards, Mike
Top
User avatar
Ovyron
Posts: 4562
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 4:30 am

Re: Deep Blunder by Rybka 2.3.2 MP

Post by Ovyron »

Mike S. wrote:This output is from my Shredder interface (version 5), which is an older "Shredder Classic" GUI.

I think Arena keeps all multi-pv lines, too. - If I provide multi-pv output from Fritz, I usually add the last (finished) depth, manually.
Ah thanks, I was able to find this feature on my Shredder Classic (Right clicking on the analysis window and choosing "Continuous Display" does the trick :) .)
Top

Return to “Computer Chess Club: General Topics”