Positional Chess Test Position: Qb6!

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swami
Posts: 6663
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 4:21 am

Positional Chess Test Position: Qb6!

Post by swami »

[d]1n1qkb1r/rp3ppp/p1p1pn2/P2p1b2/2PP4/1QN1P3/1P3PPP/R1B1KBNR w KQk - 0 8

50: Seirawan,Y - Zhu Chen, Queens-Kings 2002
1n1qkb1r/rp3ppp/p1p1pn2/P2p1b2/2PP4/1QN1P3/1P3PPP/R1B1KBNR w KQk - 0 1

Code: Select all

Analysis by Spike 1.2 Turin:

1. =  (-0.03): 8.Nf3 Nbd7 9.Nh4 Bg4 10.h3 Bh5 11.c5 Ne4 12.Nxe4 dxe4 13.g4 Qxh4 14.gxh5 Qxh5 15.Be2 Qf5 
2. =  (-0.06): 8.c5 Nbd7 9.Nge2 Be7 10.f3 e5 11.Ng3 Bg6 12.f4 exf4 13.exf4 Nh5 14.Nxh5 Bxh5 15.Be2 Bxe2 16.Kxe2 Bh4
Spike doesn't find it even at depth 16...

Engines don't understand positional chess much yet. Human GM's like Seirawan would play this in an instant.

After queen exchanges, white gets to play c5, f4, no move left for black other than let its pieces jog back and forth, left and right as waiting moves, while white can just launch an attack after development/ strategy, plans etc.
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Jouni
Posts: 3734
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:15 pm
Full name: Jouni Uski

Re: Positional Chess Test Position: Qb6!

Post by Jouni »

Analysis by bright-0.3a:

1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0
² (0.46) Depth: 9/24 00:00:00 101kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0
² (0.46) Depth: 10/27 00:00:01 210kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 Ne4 7.Nxe4 Bxe4
² (0.42) Depth: 11/31 00:00:01 782kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 Ne4 7.Nxe4 Bxe4
² (0.42) Depth: 12/35 00:00:03 1667kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 Rfc8 7.Bd2 Ng4 8.Kh1
² (0.56) Depth: 13/35 00:00:05 2944kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 Rfc8 7.Bd2 Ng4 8.Kh1
² (0.56) Depth: 14/39 00:00:09 5612kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.Bd2 Kh8 8.h3 Rg8 9.Kh1
² (0.63) Depth: 15/39 00:00:18 10268kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.Nh4 Bc2 8.Bd2 Kh8 9.Nf3
² (0.57) Depth: 16/48 00:00:34 19976kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.Nh4 Bc2 8.Bd2 Kh8 9.Nf3 Ng4 10.Ng5 Bxg5 11.Bxg4
² (0.55) Depth: 17/48 00:01:18 45218kN

Jouni
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swami
Posts: 6663
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 4:21 am

Re: Positional Chess Test Position: Qb6!

Post by swami »

Jouni wrote:Analysis by bright-0.3a:
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.Nh4 Bc2 8.Bd2 Kh8 9.Nf3 Ng4 10.Ng5 Bxg5 11.Bxg4
² (0.55) Depth: 17/48 00:01:18 45218kN
Good atleast some engines find the move, however the last line from Bright is wrong, it gives black an advantage.

Bright does not see f4, instead it just rather prefers open position fight on the king side.
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kgburcham
Posts: 2016
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2008 4:19 pm

Best Move Qb6

Post by kgburcham »

Programs do not have to understand positional chess to choose Qb6 as best move.
kgburcham

[d] 1n1qkb1r/rp3ppp/p1p1pn2/P2p1b2/2PP4/1QN1P3/1P3PPP/R1B1KBNR w KQk -

Zappa Mexico II x64
2048 Hash

11/41 0:03 +0.13 1.f3 h5 2.Nh3 Bxh3 3.gxh3 Nfd7 4.Kd2 Qf6 (6.240.973) 1775
12/43 0:07 +0.14 1.Nf3 Nbd7 2.Nd2 Be7 3.f3 O-O (13.141.282) 1840
13/45 0:11 +0.13 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h5 5.b4 Ne4 6.Bb2 Be7 7.Nxe4 Bxe4 (21.847.204) 1912
14/45 0:15 +0.17 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h5 5.b4 Be7 6.Bb2 O-O 7.Be2 Ne4 8.Nxe4 Bxe4 (30.029.339) 1931
15/46 0:24 +0.15 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h5 5.b4 h4 6.Bb2 h3 7.g3 Ne4 8.Nh4 (48.467.880) 1979
15/49 0:44 +0.15 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h5 5.b4 h4 6.Bb2 h3 7.g3 Ne4 8.Nh4 (86.424.407) 1957
16/49 0:57 +0.18 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h6 5.h3 Be7 6.g4 Bh7 7.Rg1 g5 8.b4 Ne4 (114.368.350) 1992
16/51 1:09 +0.18 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h6 5.h3 Be7 6.g4 Bh7 7.Rg1 g5 8.b4 Ne4 (139.502.684) 1998
17/53 1:29 +0.18 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h6 5.h3 Be7 6.g4 Bh7 7.Rg1 g5 8.Bd2 Ne4 9.Bd3 (180.984.129) 2032
18/53 2:59 +0.21 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h6 5.h3 Be7 6.b4 O-O 7.g4 Bg6 8.Bb2 Ne4 9.Be2 f5 (368.602.852) 2058
18/55 3:54 +0.21 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h6 5.h3 Be7 6.b4 O-O 7.g4 Bg6 8.Bb2 Ne4 9.Be2 f5 (478.799.637) 2039
19/57 5:47 +0.21 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 h6 5.h3 Be7 6.b4 O-O 7.g4 Bg6 8.Rg1 Bh7 9.Bb2 g5 10.Rc1 (719.050.400) 2068
20/59 11:40 +0.23 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 Be7 5.b4 O-O 6.Bb2 h5 7.h3 Ne4 8.Nxe4 Bxe4 9.Be2 g5 10.O-O Bf5 (1.447.577.920) 2065
20/59 16:09 +0.23 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Nf3 Be7 5.b4 O-O 6.Bb2 h5 7.h3 Ne4 8.Nxe4 Bxe4 9.Be2 g5 10.O-O Bf5 (1.967.890.641) 2029
21/61 29:37 +0.22 1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.b4 O-O 5.Nf3 Nbd7 6.Bb2 Ne4 7.Be2 g5 8.h3 Bf6 9.Nxe4 Bxe4 10.O-O Kh8 11.Nd2 (3.682.652.749) 2071
best move: Qb3-b6 time: 30:33.296 min n/s: 1.834.828 nodes: 3.786.401.232
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Martin Thoresen
Posts: 1833
Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 12:07 am

Re: Positional Chess Test Position: Qb6!

Post by Martin Thoresen »

swami wrote:[d]1n1qkb1r/rp3ppp/p1p1pn2/P2p1b2/2PP4/1QN1P3/1P3PPP/R1B1KBNR w KQk - 0 8

50: Seirawan,Y - Zhu Chen, Queens-Kings 2002
1n1qkb1r/rp3ppp/p1p1pn2/P2p1b2/2PP4/1QN1P3/1P3PPP/R1B1KBNR w KQk - 0 1

Code: Select all

1n1qkb1r/rp3ppp/p1p1pn2/P2p1b2/2PP4/1QN1P3/1P3PPP/R1B1KBNR w KQk - 0 1

Analysis by Bright-0.3b  4CPU (@3.4 GHz)

1.Nf3 Bd6 2.Ne5 dxc4 3.Qxc4 
  =  (-0.05)   Depth: 2/8   00:00:00
1.Nf3 Bd6 2.Ne5 dxc4 3.Qxc4 
  =  (-0.05)   Depth: 2/8   00:00:00
1.Nf3 Bd6 2.Ne5 dxc4 3.Qxc4 
  =  (-0.05)   Depth: 2/8   00:00:00
1.Nf3 Bd6 2.Ne5 dxc4 3.Qxc4 
  =  (-0.05)   Depth: 2/8   00:00:00
1.Nf3 Bd6 2.Ne5 dxc4 3.Qxc4 
  =  (-0.05)   Depth: 3/8   00:00:00
1.Be2 dxc4 2.Qxc4 
  =  (-0.03)   Depth: 3/8   00:00:00
1.Be2 dxc4 2.Qxc4 Bd6 3.Nf3 
  =  (-0.06)   Depth: 4/11   00:00:00
1.Nf3 Nbd7 2.Be2 Bd6 3.0-0 
  =  (-0.04)   Depth: 4/11   00:00:00
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.Nf3 
  ²  (0.31)   Depth: 4/13   00:00:00
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.Nf3 
  ²  (0.31)   Depth: 5/17   00:00:00
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.Nf3 Nbd7 4.c5 
  =  (0.20)   Depth: 6/17   00:00:00  13kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.Nf3 Nbd7 4.c5 Ne4 5.Bd3 
  ²  (0.29)   Depth: 7/17   00:00:00  27kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 
  =  (0.13)   Depth: 8/18   00:00:00  51kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 Ng4 6.0-0 
  =  (0.10)   Depth: 9/20   00:00:00  129kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 Ng4 6.0-0 
  =  (0.10)   Depth: 10/21   00:00:01  318kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Be2 Ne4 5.Nf3 Nxc3 6.bxc3 Nd7 7.Bb2 
  ²  (0.28)   Depth: 11/26   00:00:01  1187kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Be2 0-0 5.Nf3 Nbd7 6.0-0 Ng4 7.Bd2 
  =  (0.11)   Depth: 12/31   00:00:01  1834kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 Rfe8 7.Bd2 Ng4 8.Kh1 
  =  (0.17)   Depth: 13/33   00:00:01  5350kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 Rfc8 7.Bd2 Ng4 8.Kh1 
  =  (0.13)   Depth: 14/38   00:00:02  7999kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 Rfe8 7.b4 Rec8 8.Bb2 Ng4 9.Kh1 
  =  (0.18)   Depth: 15/44   00:00:04  26854kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Be7 4.Nf3 Nbd7 5.Be2 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.h3 Kh7 8.Bd2 Rh8 9.Kh1 
  =  (0.24)   Depth: 16/47   00:00:06  40453kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Be2 Be7 5.Nf3 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.Nh4 Bc2 8.Bd2 Rfc8 9.Nf3 Ng4 10.Ng5 
  =  (0.21)   Depth: 17/47   00:00:12  81850kN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Be2 Be7 5.Nf3 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.h3 Kh8 8.Bd2 Rg8 9.Kh2 Bc2 10.Rh1 
  ²  (0.26)   Depth: 18/49   00:00:27  179mN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Be2 Be7 5.Nf3 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.h3 Kh8 8.Bd2 Rg8 9.Kh2 Bc2 10.Rh1 Bf5 11.b4 
  ²  (0.30)   Depth: 19/49   00:00:52  338mN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Be2 Be7 5.Nf3 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.h3 Kh8 8.Bd2 Rg8 9.Kh1 Bg6 10.b4 Bf5 11.Rg1 
  ²  (0.28)   Depth: 20/53   00:02:11  810mN
1.Qb6 Qxb6 2.axb6 Ra8 3.c5 Nbd7 4.Be2 Be7 5.Nf3 0-0 6.0-0 h6 7.h3 e5 8.dxe5 Ne4 9.Nxe4 dxe4 10.Nd4 Bg6 11.e6 Nxc5 12.exf7+ Bxf7 13.Bd2 
  ²  (0.29)   Depth: 21/63   00:06:01  2227mN
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