Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

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Uri Blass
Posts: 11150
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:37 am
Location: Tel-Aviv Israel

Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by Uri Blass »

Did somebody make a long analysis of all of the 960 position and later made a deeper analysis of the positions with the biggest white advantage?
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Guenther
Posts: 4718
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 6:33 am
Location: Regensburg, Germany
Full name: Guenther Simon

Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by Guenther »

Uri Blass wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:29 pm Did somebody make a long analysis of all of the 960 position and later made a deeper analysis of the positions with the biggest white advantage?
You know this stats from CCRL?
http://computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/404FRC ... able_start
https://rwbc-chess.de

[Trolls n'existent pas...]
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Uri Blass
Posts: 11150
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:37 am
Location: Tel-Aviv Israel

Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by Uri Blass »

I get the following analysis for the position that is the most unbalanced position based on statistics.

[d]qbbrkrnn/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/QBBRKRNN w KQkq - 0 1

Stockfish_21041512_x64_avx2:
Found 145 tablebases
NNUE evaluation using nn-62ef826d1a6d.nnue enabled
1/1 00:00 119 60k +0.80 f2-f4
2/2 00:00 271 136k +1.30 f2-f4 b7-b6
3/3 00:00 566 283k +1.01 d2-d4 b7-b6 d4-d5
4/4 00:00 838 419k +1.77 d2-d4 b7-b5 d4-d5
5/5 00:00 2k 940k +1.00 d2-d4 d7-d5 f2-f4 f7-f5 Nh1-f2
6/6 00:00 4k 1,965k +0.68 d2-d4 f7-f5 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 f2-f4 Nh8-f7
7/8 00:00 6k 2,943k +0.75 d2-d4 Nh8-g6 f2-f4 Ng6-h4 Ng1-f3 Nh4xf3+ Rf1xf3 f7-f5
8/8 00:00 7k 3,308k +0.93 d2-d4 Nh8-g6 f2-f4 Ng6-h4 Ng1-f3 Nh4xf3+ Rf1xf3 f7-f5
9/11 00:00 57k 7,129k +0.11 Ng1-f3 Ng8-f6 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 O-O O-O d2-d4
10/14 00:00 66k 7,348k +0.49 c2-c4 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 Ng8-f6 d2-d4 d7-d5 c4xd5
11/15 00:00 255k 8,213k +0.08 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 d2-d4 O-O O-O
12/13 00:00 313k 8,462k +0.27 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 c2-c4 O-O Ng1-f3 c7-c5 b2-b4 b7-b5 c4xb5 c5-c4 O-O
13/17 00:00 425k 8,176k +0.14 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 c2-c4 O-O Ng1-f3 c7-c5 O-O
14/21 00:00 468k 8,208k +0.26 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 c2-c4 O-O Ng1-f3 c7-c5 b2-b4 b7-b6 b4xc5 b6xc5 O-O
15/23 00:00 757k 8,414k +0.32 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 d7-d5 Nf5-g3 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 Bb8-d6 O-O Qa8-b8 Rd1-e1 Ke8-f8
16/21 00:00 986k 8,501k +0.36 d2-d4 Ng8-f6 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 O-O Nh8-g6 b2-b3 O-O
17/25 00:00 1,402k 8,708k +0.34 Ng1-f3 Ng8-f6 d2-d4 d7-d5 b2-b3 O-O O-O b7-b6 c2-c4 d5xc4 b3xc4 c7-c5 d4-d5 b6-b5 e2-e4 b5xc4 Bc1-b2
18/27 00:00 1,817k 8,820k +0.40 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 d2-d4 Ng8-f6 b2-b3 O-O O-O b7-b6 c2-c4 c7-c5 d4xc5 d5xc4 b3xc4 b6xc5
19/29 00:00 3,197k 8,664k +0.41 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 b2-b3 Ng8-f6 d2-d4 O-O O-O b7-b6 c2-c4
20/28 00:00 5,997k 9,045k +0.54 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 d7-d5 c2-c3 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 b7-b6 O-O c7-c5 a2-a4 e7-e6 Nf5-g3 Bc8-b7 a4-a5 Bb8-d6 Rf1-e1 c5-c4 a5xb6 a7xb6 Qa1xa8
21/28 00:00 8,626k 9,080k +0.55 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 d7-d5 c2-c4 d5xc4 Ng1-f3 e7-e6 Nf5-e3 b7-b5 O-O Nh8-g6 Rf1-e1 Bc8-b7 a2-a4 a7-a6 b2-b3 c4xb3 Qa1-a3 Rg8-h8
22/30 00:01 11,034k 9,074k +0.69 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 d2-d3 Ng8-e7 Nh5-g3 c7-c5 c2-c4 d5-d4 Bb1-c2 Rf8-g8 O-O Ng6-f4 Qa1-b1 Bc8-g4 b2-b4 Nf4xe2+ Ng3xe2
23/42 00:01 17,384k 9,012k +0.64 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 d2-d3 Bc8-g4 Nh5-g3 Ng8-e7 O-O Rf8-g8 c2-c4 Ng6-f4 Rf1-e1 d5-d4 Nf3-h4 Nf4-g6 Nh4xg6 h7xg6 f2-f3 Bg4-c8 e2-e4
24/37 00:02 21,123k 9,050k +0.68 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 d7-d5 c2-c4 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 Nf6-e4 Nf5-e3 b7-b6 O-O g7-g5 Nf3-d2 Ne4xd2 Bc1xd2 Nh8-g6 c4xd5 c6xd5 Bb1-c2 f7-f6 g2-g3 Bc8-h3 Rf1-e1 Ke8-f7 Qa1-b1
25/38- 00:03 27,285k 8,972k +0.60 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
25/38+ 00:03 31,222k 8,954k +0.78 Nh1-g3
25/38 00:03 32,937k 8,916k +0.86 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 d7-d5 c2-c4 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 Nf6-e4 Nf5-e3 f7-f5 c4xd5 c6xd5 Nf3-e5 Nh8-f7 f2-f3 Ne4-f6 b2-b4 g7-g6 O-O Bb8-d6 b4-b5 Qa8-b8 f3-f4 Ke8-f8 Bb1-d3 Kf8-g7 a2-a4 Bc8-e6 a4-a5
26/42+ 00:04 43,030k 8,938k +0.94 Nh1-g3
26/42 00:05 46,603k 8,911k +0.96 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Bb8-c7 O-O Qa8-b8 c4xd5 c6xd5 a2-a4 Nf6-e4 Nf5-e3 Bc8-e6 Qa1-a3 g7-g5 Qa3-b3 Nh8-g6 Bb1xe4 d5xe4 d4-d5 e4xf3 d5xe6 Bc7xh2+ Kg1-h1
27/37- 00:05 49,734k 8,906k +0.87 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6
27/37- 00:07 63,863k 8,916k +0.79 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6
27/38 00:07 67,046k 8,913k +0.80 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 d7-d5 c2-c4 d5xc4 Ng1-f3 e7-e6 Nf5-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 c4xb3 O-O Bc8-b7 a2xb3 Bb7xf3 e2xf3 Nh8-g6 Bc1-g5 Qa8-d5 Bg5xf6 g7xf6 Ng3-e4 Ke8-e7 Qa1-a3+ Rd8-d6 Ne4xd6 Qd5xd6 Qa3xd6+ Ke7xd6 g2-g3 f6-f5 d4-d5
28/40+ 00:08 75,899k 8,914k +0.88 Nh1-g3
28/40+ 00:08 80,006k 8,919k +0.97 Nh1-g3
28/40- 00:09 88,107k 8,909k +0.72 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6
28/40 00:11 102,402k 8,881k +0.76 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Nf6-h5 b2-b3 f7-f6 d2-d4 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 g7-g6 Nf5-g3 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Nh8-f7 c2-c4 O-O O-O d7-d6 d4-d5 c6xd5 c4xd5 a7-a5 Qa1-d4 Bb8-a7 Qd4-f4 Ba7-c5 Nf3-d4 Nf7-e5 Qf4-e4 Bc8-g4 Nd4-e6 Bg4xe6 d5xe6 Qa8-c8 Bc1-h6 Rf8-e8
29/39+ 00:12 106,895k 8,876k +0.84 Nh1-g3
29/40+ 00:12 110,468k 8,879k +0.92 Nh1-g3
29/40- 00:14 126,110k 8,842k +0.68 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
29/41+ 00:16 147,538k 8,786k +0.86 Nh1-g3
29/41 00:16 149,192k 8,786k +0.82 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 c2-c4 Nh8-g6 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 d2-d4 d7-d5 Ng1-f3 Ke8-f7 c4xd5 Qa8xd5 Nh5-g3 Qd5-d6 O-O e7-e6 Ng3-e4 Qd6-d7 Bb1-d3 Bc8-b7 g2-g3 Ng8-e7 b2-b4 Bb7-d5 b4-b5 c7-c6 Ne4-c3 Bd5xf3 e2xf3 c6xb5
30/43- 00:17 157,325k 8,789k +0.74 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
30/43- 00:18 163,174k 8,784k +0.66 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
30/43+ 00:19 170,109k 8,778k +0.74 Nh1-g3
30/48+ 00:20 178,834k 8,757k +0.92 Nh1-g3
30/48 00:20 182,346k 8,760k +0.93 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 c2-c4 Nh8-g6 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Ng1-f3 Ke8-f7 d2-d4 d7-d5 c4xd5 Qa8xd5 Nh5-g3 Bc8-g4 Bb1-e4 Qd5-d7 O-O c7-c6 Qa1-b1 e7-e6 h2-h3 Bg4xf3 Be4xf3 Ng8-e7 e2-e4 Kf7-g8 Rf1-e1 f6-f5 Bc1-g5 Bb8-f4 Bg5xe7 Ng6xe7 Ng3-e2 Bf4-g5 Qb1-c2 f5xe4 Bf3xe4
31/47- 00:27 236,907k 8,620k +0.85 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
31/47+ 00:27 237,195k 8,618k +0.93 Nh1-g3
31/47 00:29 255,093k 8,563k +0.82 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 d7-d5 c2-c4 d5xc4 b2-b3 b7-b6 Ng1-f3 c4xb3 a2xb3 Nh8-g6 O-O Qa8-d5 Nf5-g3 Bc8-g4 e2-e4 Qd5-d7 Qa1-c3 c7-c5 d4-d5 Bg4xf3 Qc3xf3 Qd7-g4 Qf3-c3 Bb8xg3 f2xg3 Nf6xe4 Qc3-a1 Ne4-d6
32/43+ 00:30 261,896k 8,546k +0.90 Nh1-g3
32/43+ 00:32 276,505k 8,519k +0.98 Nh1-g3
32/43 00:32 278,437k 8,514k +0.91 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 c2-c4 Nh8-g6 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Ng1-f3 Ke8-f7 d2-d4 d7-d5 c4xd5 Qa8xd5 Nh5-g3 Bc8-g4 Bb1-e4 Qd5-d7 O-O c7-c6 h2-h3 Bg4xf3 Be4xf3 e7-e6 e2-e4 Ng8-e7 Qa1-b1 Kf7-g8 Ng3-h5 Kg8-h8 Qb1-c2 Qd7-c7 g2-g3 f6-f5 Bc1-e3 f5-f4 Nh5xf4 Ng6xf4 Be3xf4 Rf8xf4 g3xf4
33/47- 00:35 299,536k 8,461k +0.83 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
33/47- 00:40 341,703k 8,371k +0.75 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
33/47+ 00:49 407,859k 8,272k +0.83 Nh1-g3
33/47- 00:50 418,514k 8,260k +0.62 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
33/49 00:52 430,532k 8,243k +0.68 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 e7-e5 d2-d3 c7-c5 b2-b4 Nh8-g6 O-O Ng8-e7 b4xc5 b6xc5 c2-c4 Bc8-g4 Nh5-g3 d5-d4 Rd1-e1 Ng6-f4 Qa1-b2 Qa8-c6 Bb1-c2 Ne7-g6 Qb2-b5 Qc6-c8 Bc1xf4 Ng6xf4 Nf3-h4 Kf7-g7 Qb5-a5 Kg7-h8 e2-e3 d4xe3 f2xe3 Nf4xd3 Bc2xd3 Rd8xd3 e3-e4 Qc8-e6 Qa5xc5
34/48+ 00:52 436,204k 8,238k +0.76 Nh1-g3
34/48 00:55 455,478k 8,214k +0.64 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 e7-e5 d2-d3 Nh8-g6 b2-b4 Ng8-e7 c2-c4 Bc8-g4 Nh5-g3 c7-c6 O-O h7-h5 h2-h3 Bg4xf3 e2xf3 h5-h4 Ng3-e2 d5-d4 Bb1-c2 c6-c5 b4xc5 b6xc5 Qa1-b1 Qa8-c6 Kg1-h1 Rf8-g8 Rf1-g1
35/45+ 00:57 472,206k 8,199k +0.72 Nh1-g3
35/50+ 00:59 487,426k 8,187k +0.80 Nh1-g3
35/50+ 01:01 504,771k 8,174k +0.93 Nh1-g3
35/50 01:22 670,736k 8,094k +0.91 Nh1-g3 Nh8-g6 Ng3-f5 f7-f6 Nf5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 d7-d5 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 d2-d3 b7-b6 b2-b4 c7-c5 b4xc5 b6xc5 c2-c4 d5-d4 O-O Ng8-e7 Nh5-g3 Bc8-g4 Qa1-b2 Qa8-c6 Rd1-e1 Ng6-f4 Bc1xf4 e5xf4 Ng3-e4 Rf8-g8 Qb2-b5 Bg4-h3 Nf3-g5+ f6xg5 Qb5xc6 Ne7xc6 g2xh3 Bb8-d6 Kg1-g2
36/51- 01:28 715,268k 8,074k +0.83 Nh1-g3 Nh8-g6
36/51+ 01:35 769,933k 8,058k +0.91 Nh1-g3
36/51 01:42 822,293k 8,046k +0.92 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 d2-d4 b7-b6 Ng1-f3 d7-d5 c2-c4 d5xc4 b2-b3 c4xb3 a2xb3 Nh8-g6 O-O Qa8-d5 Nf5-e3 Qd5-h5 g2-g3 c7-c6 Qa1-c3 Bc8-d7 Bc1-a3 Ke8-f8 Rf1-e1 a7-a5 Rd1-c1 Bb8-d6 Ba3xd6 e7xd6 b3-b4 Ng6-e7 b4xa5 Qh5xa5 Qc3xa5 b6xa5 Ne3-c4 g7-g6 Nc4xd6 Kf8-g7
37/47- 01:58 951,400k 8,005k +0.84 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
37/60+ 02:18 1,106,280k 7,973k +0.92 Nh1-g3
37/60 02:19 1,115,685k 7,973k +0.81 Nh1-g3 Nh8-g6 Ng3-f5 f7-f6 Nf5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-f5 c7-c5 c2-c3 b7-b6 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 O-O d7-d5 Nf3-h4 Ng6xh4 Nf5xh4 Ng8-e7 d2-d4 c5xd4 c3xd4 e5-e4 f2-f3 Ne7-g6 Nh4xg6 h7xg6 f3xe4 d5xe4 Bb1-c2 Kf7-g7 Bc1-f4 Bb8xf4 Rf1xf4 f6-f5 d4-d5 g6-g5 Rf4-f1 Rd8xd5 b2-b3+ Kg7-g8 Bc2xe4 Rd5xd1 Be4xa8 Rd1xa1 Rf1xa1
38/3+ 02:26 1,166,729k 7,962k +0.89 Nh1-g3
38/45+ 02:36 1,243,250k 7,953k +0.98 Nh1-g3
38/54 02:42 1,287,777k 7,948k +0.89 Nh1-g3 Nh8-g6 Ng3-f5 f7-f6 Nf5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-f5 c7-c5 c2-c3 b7-b6 g2-g3 e7-e6 Nf5-e3 d7-d5 d2-d4 Kf7-g7 Ng1-f3 e6-e5 d4xe5 f6xe5 c3-c4 d5-d4 Ne3-d5 Ng6-e7 Nd5xe7 Ng8xe7 Nf3-g5 Qa8-g2 Bb1-e4 Qg2xh2 Ng5-f3 Qh2-h5 Nf3-h4 Ne7-g8 Rf1-h1 Qh5-f7 Nh4-f3 h7-h6 b2-b3 Bb8-d6 Qa1-b1 Bc8-g4 Rh1-h4 Bg4-f5 Be4xf5 Qf7xf5 Qb1xf5 Rf8xf5 Bc1-b2 Ng8-f6
39/50+ 02:53 1,375,562k 7,938k +0.98 Nh1-g3
39/50- 03:14 1,538,847k 7,925k +0.81 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
39/51+ 03:32 1,686,422k 7,920k +0.93 Nh1-g3
39/54 03:42 1,758,729k 7,919k +0.81 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 Nh8-g6 f2-f3 c7-c5 g2-g3 d5-d4 a2-a4 b7-b6 Bb1-a2+ e7-e6 d2-d3 Ng8-e7 Ng1-h3 Kf7-g8 Bc1-h6 Rf8-f7 Nh3-f2 Kg8-h8 Ba2-c4 Ng6-e5 O-O-O Ne5xc4 d3xc4 e6-e5 g3-g4 Qa8-c6 Bh6-d2 f6-f5 g4xf5 Ne7xf5 b2-b3 Rd8-g8 Nh5-g3 Nf5xg3 h2xg3 Rg8xg3 Nf2-e4
40/47+ 03:50 1,827,611k 7,913k +0.89 Nh1-g3
40/49+ 03:53 1,847,025k 7,912k +0.98 Nh1-g3
40/53+ 04:15 2,015,810k 7,899k +1.10 Nh1-g3
40/59 04:42 2,225,453k 7,882k +0.99 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Rf8-g8 b2-b3 c7-c5 d2-d4 c5xd4 Qa1xd4 b7-b6 Bc1-a3 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 Qa8-e4 c2-c4 Qe4xd4 Nf3xd4 Bc8-b7 O-O d7-d5 c4xd5 Nf6xd5 Bb1-e4 e7-e6 Nf5-e3 Nd5xe3 Be4xb7 Ne3xd1 Bb7-c6+ Rd8-d7 Rf1xd1 Ng6-e5 Bc6-b5 g7-g5 g2-g3 g5-g4 Kg1-g2 Ke8-d8 Bb5xd7 Kd8xd7 Nd4-f5+ Kd7-c7 Ba3-b2 Kc7-b7
41/56+ 05:37 2,651,758k 7,868k +1.07 Nh1-g3
41/56+ 06:20 2,997,887k 7,873k +1.15 Nh1-g3
41/56- 06:54 3,264,035k 7,868k +0.85 Nh1-g3 Nh8-g6
41/59+ 07:43 3,647,792k 7,866k +1.09 Nh1-g3
41/59 07:52 3,716,093k 7,866k +0.99 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 Qa8xg2 Qa1xg7 Ng8-f6 c2-c4 Rf8-g8 Qg7-h6 d7-d5 c4xd5 Nf6-g4 Qh6xh7 Ng4-f6 Qh7-c2 Qg2xd5 d2-d4 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Qd5-b5 e4-e5 Nf6-d5 f2-f4 c7-c5 Ng1-e2 c5xd4 Rd1xd4 Bc8-b7 Qc2-c4 Qb5xc4 b3xc4 Nd5-c7 Rd4xd8+ Ke8xd8 Ng3-e4 Bb7-a6 c4-c5 Nc7-d5 Ne4-g5 b6xc5 Ng5xf7+ Kd8-e8 Bb1-e4 Ke8xf7 Be4xd5+ e7-e6
42/43- 08:04 3,811,882k 7,865k +0.90 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
42/55- 09:08 4,312,409k 7,866k +0.82 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
42/55+ 09:35 4,523,465k 7,865k +0.90 Nh1-g3
42/60- 09:51 4,649,059k 7,860k +0.70 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
42/60+ 10:10 4,795,102k 7,858k +0.89 Nh1-g3
42/60 11:05 5,225,279k 7,856k +0.82 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 Qa8xg2 Qa1xg7 Ng8-f6 c2-c4 Rf8-g8 Qg7-h6 d7-d5 c4xd5 Nf6-g4 Qh6xh7 Ng4-f6 Qh7-c2 Qg2xd5 Bc1-b2 Nh8-g6 Bb2xf6 e7xf6 Qc2-c3 Ng6-f4 O-O-O c7-c5 Bb1-e4 Qd5-d6 e2-e3 Nf4-d5 Be4xd5 Qd6xd5 d2-d4 c5xd4 Rd1xd4 Bb8-e5 Rd4xd5 Be5xc3 Rd5xd8+ Ke8xd8 Rf1-d1+ Kd8-c7 h2-h4 Bc3-e5 Ng1-e2 Rg8-h8 h4-h5 Bc8-g4 Kc1-c2 Bg4xh5
43/58- 11:17 5,320,521k 7,853k +0.74 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
43/58- 11:52 5,595,216k 7,853k +0.66 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
43/58+ 11:58 5,646,506k 7,855k +0.74 Nh1-g3
43/58 12:04 5,687,592k 7,856k +0.78 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 Qa8xg2 Qa1xg7 Ng8-f6 c2-c4 Rf8-g8 Qg7-h6 d7-d5 c4xd5 Nf6-g4 Qh6xh7 Ng4-f6 Qh7-c2 Qg2xd5 Bc1-b2 Nh8-g6 Bb2xf6 e7xf6 Qc2-c3 Ng6-f4 O-O-O c7-c5 Bb1-e4 Qd5-e5 Qc3xe5+ f6xe5 h2-h4 Rg8-h8 Ng1-f3 Ke8-e7 Kc1-c2 Rd8-f8 e2-e3 f7-f5 Be4-a8 Nf4-g2 Nf3xe5 Ng2xe3+ d2xe3 Bb8xe5 Rf1-h1 Bc8-e6 Ba8-f3 Rf8-d8 Rd1xd8 Ke7xd8
44/54- 12:29 5,887,473k 7,860k +0.70 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
44/61+ 12:44 6,010,559k 7,862k +0.78 Nh1-g3
44/61- 13:18 6,279,960k 7,866k +0.62 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
44/61+ 13:24 6,329,906k 7,866k +0.76 Nh1-g3
44/61 13:52 6,554,364k 7,869k +0.92 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 Qa8xg2 c2-c4 d7-d5 Qa1xg7 Ng8-f6 Ng3-h5 Rf8-g8 Qg7xg2 Rg8xg2 Nh5xf6+ e7xf6 Bc1-b2 Nh8-g6 Bb2xf6 Rd8-d6 Bf6-b2 d5xc4 b3xc4 Rg2xh2 Ng1-f3 Rh2-h5 Rf1-g1 Bc8-b7 Nf3-g5 Rh5-h4 d2-d4 h7-h6 Ng5-h7 Bb7-e4 Bb1xe4 Rh4xe4 e2-e3 f7-f5 Rg1-h1 f5-f4 Rd1-d3 c7-c5 Rh1xh6 Ng6-e5 d4xe5 Rd6xh6 Nh7-f6+ Rh6xf6 e5xf6 Re4xc4 Ke1-d2 f4xe3+ Kd2xe3 Bb8-f4+ Ke3-f3
45/57- 14:13 6,719,074k 7,870k +0.84 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
45/57- 14:26 6,817,337k 7,871k +0.75 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
45/60 14:57 7,063,159k 7,871k +0.74 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 Qa8xg2 c2-c4 d7-d5 Qa1xg7 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Rf8-g8 Qg7-h6 Nf6-g4 Qh6xh7 Ng4-f6 Qh7-c2 Qg2xd5 Bc1-b2 Nh8-g6 Bb2xf6 e7xf6 Qc2-c3 Ng6-f4 O-O-O c7-c5 Bb1-e4 Qd5-e5 Qc3xe5+ f6xe5 h2-h4 Rg8-h8 e2-e3 Nf4-d5 h4-h5 Nd5-f6 Be4-f3 Bc8-e6 Ng1-e2 c5-c4 Kc1-c2 Bb8-d6 Rf1-h1 c4xb3+ a2xb3 Rd8-c8+ Kc2-b2 a7-a5 d2-d4 Rh8-h6 Rd1-c1 e5xd4 Ne2xd4 Bd6-e5 Rc1xc8+ Be6xc8 Rh1-c1 Bc8-d7 Kb2-b1 Be5xd4 e3xd4 Ke8-f8
46/57- 15:14 7,197,039k 7,873k +0.65 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
46/60- 16:11 7,654,636k 7,878k +0.57 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
46/60+ 16:23 7,744,715k 7,879k +0.65 Nh1-g3
46/60 16:30 7,800,677k 7,879k +0.67 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 Qa8xg2 c2-c4 d7-d5 Qa1xg7 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Rf8-g8 Qg7-h6 Nf6-g4 Qh6xh7 Ng4-f6 Qh7-c2 Qg2xd5 Bc1-b2 Nh8-g6 Bb2xf6 e7xf6 Qc2-c3 Ng6-f4 O-O-O c7-c5 Bb1-e4 Qd5-e5 e2-e3 Nf4-d5 Qc3xe5+ f6xe5 Ng1-e2 Rg8-h8 h2-h4 Rh8xh4 Rf1-h1 Rh4xh1 Rd1xh1 Nd5-f6 f2-f3 Nf6xe4 f3xe4 Bc8-e6 Ng3-f5 Ke8-d7 Nf5-g7 b6-b5 Ng7xe6 f7xe6 Rh1-h7+ Kd7-d6 Rh7-h6 Rd8-f8 Kc1-c2 c5-c4 b3xc4
47/61+ 17:40 8,357,860k 7,878k +0.75 Nh1-g3
47/61+ 17:53 8,458,406k 7,879k +0.83 Nh1-g3
47/64+ 18:22 8,686,484k 7,878k +0.96 Nh1-g3
47/64 18:38 8,813,156k 7,877k +0.88 Nh1-g3 b7-b6 b2-b3 Qa8xg2 c2-c4 d7-d5 Qa1xg7 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Rf8-g8 Qg7-h6 Nf6-g4 Qh6xh7 Ng4-f6 Qh7-c2 Qg2xd5 Bc1-b2 Nh8-g6 Bb2xf6 e7xf6 e2-e3 c7-c5 Qc2-e4+ Qd5xe4 Bb1xe4 Rg8-h8 f2-f4 Rh8xh2 Ng1-f3 Rh2-g2 Ng3-f5 Ke8-f8 Rf1-f2 Rg2xf2 Ke1xf2 Ng6-e7 Nf5-g3 Bb8-c7 Rd1-h1 Bc8-g4 Rh1-h7 Bg4xf3 Kf2xf3 Rd8xd2 Rh7-h8+ Ne7-g8 Be4-h7 Kf8-g7 Rh8xg8+ Kg7xh7 Rg8-c8 Bc7-d6 Rc8-c6 Kh7-h8 Ng3-e4 Rd2xa2
48/36- 20:22 9,615,247k 7,868k +0.80 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
48/62- 21:06 9,964,567k 7,867k +0.72 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
48/62+ 22:32 10,631,464k 7,861k +0.80 Nh1-g3
48/69+ 28:01 13,203,206k 7,854k +0.98 Nh1-g3
48/69 29:44 13,996,601k 7,843k +0.84 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 d2-d3 c7-c5 b2-b4 b7-b6 c2-c4 d5-d4 b4xc5 b6xc5 Bb1-c2 Ng8-e7 Nh5-g3 Bc8-g4 Qa1-b1 Rf8-g8 Ng3-e4 Bb8-d6 Qb1-b5 Qa8-c8 g2-g3 Bg4xf3 e2xf3 Ng6-f8 O-O f6-f5 Ne4-g5+ Kf7-f6 Ng5-h3 f5-f4 Kg1-g2 Ne7-f5 Nh3-g1 Nf8-e6 Rd1-e1 Rg8-g7 Kg2-h1 Rd8-g8 Qb5-b1 h7-h5 Bc2-d1 Ne6-g5 Qb1-c2
49/63+ 29:56 14,086,817k 7,843k +0.92 Nh1-g3
49/70+ 32:16 15,182,867k 7,839k +1.00 Nh1-g3
49/70 36:57 17,380,126k 7,838k +1.06 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Nf6-h5 b2-b3 f7-f6 d2-d4 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 g7-g6 Nf5-g3 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Bb8-c7 O-O O-O c2-c4 d7-d5 Qa1-c3 Bc8-f5 Bb1xf5 g6xf5 Bc1-f4 Qa8-c8 e2-e3
50/62- 43:11 20,329,387k 7,846k +0.98 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6
50/62- 47:17 22,202,471k 7,824k +0.89 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/72- 54:19 25,472,062k 7,815k +0.59 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/78+ 55:19 25,938,069k 7,815k +0.73 Nh1-g3
50/78- 1:09:12 32,350,508k 7,791k +0.35 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/78+ 1:10:04 32,746,858k 7,789k +0.70 Nh1-g3
50/78 1:10:41 33,019,106k 7,785k +0.47 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-f4 d2-d4 Nf6-h5 Ng1-e2 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Nf4xe2 Kf2xe2 c7-c6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Ke2-f2 Bb8-c7 b2-b3 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Bc8-e6 Bb1-e4 Qb8-b5 Qa1-c3 Be6-d5 a2-a4 Qb5-b7 Bc1-a3 f7-f6 Be4xh7 Qb7xb3 Qc3xb3 Bd5xb3 Rd1-b1 Rd8-b8 Bh7-e4 Ke8-d7 Be4-f5+ Kd7-d8 e5-e6 g7-g6 Bf5-e4 Bb3xe6 Rb1xb8+ Bc7xb8 Be4xc6 Be6-d7 Bc6-e4 Bb8-d6 Ba3xd6 e7xd6 Be4xg6 Bd7xa4
51/61+ 1:12:14 33,731,901k 7,782k +0.55 Nh1-g3
51/70+ 1:12:52 34,026,166k 7,782k +0.63 Nh1-g3
51/70+ 1:13:24 34,257,259k 7,777k +0.76 Nh1-g3
51/70 1:14:04 34,537,913k 7,772k +0.41 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-f4 d2-d4 Nf6-h5 Ng1-e2 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Nf4xe2 Kf2xe2 c7-c6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Ke2-f2 Bb8-c7 b2-b3 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Bc8-e6 Bb1-e4 Qb8-b5 Qa1-c3 Be6-d5 g3-g4 Bc7-a5 Qc3-c2 Ba5-b6 Bc1-e3 f7-f6 e5xf6 Rf8xf6 g4-g5 Bd5xe4 Qc2xe4 Rf6-f5 Rf1-h1 Qb5-d5 Qe4xd5 Rf5xd5 Rh1xh7 Ke8-f7 Kf2-g3 Bb6xd4
52/21+ 1:14:39 34,798,646k 7,769k +0.49 Nh1-g3
52/21+ 1:15:24 35,143,808k 7,768k +0.57 Nh1-g3
52/21+ 1:16:07 35,479,036k 7,768k +0.70 Nh1-g3
52/70 1:19:21 36,906,034k 7,751k +0.55 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 c7-c6 d2-d4 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-h4 b2-b4 h7-h6 Qa1-c3 g7-g5 a2-a4 a7-a6 Ng1-e2 Bc8-h3 Rf1-g1 Qa8-a7 d5xc6 b7xc6 Bc1-e3 Qa7-b7 Rd1-c1 Bh3-d7 Qc3-c4 Bd7-g4 Qc4xc6+ Qb7xc6 Rc1xc6 Bg4xf3 h2-h3 g5-g4 Rc6xf6 e7xf6 h3xg4 Rf8-g8 Bb1-d3 Rg8xg4 Bd3xa6 f6-f5 Ng3xf5 Nh4xf5 Kf2xf3 Nf5xe3 Kf3xe3 Bb8-f4+ Ke3-d3 Rg4xg1 Ba6-b5+ Ke8-e7 Ne2xg1 h6-h5 Bb5-c6
53/27+ 1:24:24 39,225,326k 7,745k +0.63 Nh1-g3
53/61- 1:30:44 42,157,413k 7,743k +0.47 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
53/61+ 1:32:21 42,922,390k 7,745k +0.59 Nh1-g3
53/71+ 1:36:40 44,935,008k 7,746k +0.76 Nh1-g3
53/73 1:41:03 47,000,937k 7,751k +0.59 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 c7-c6 d2-d4 Ng6-h4 f2-f3 Nh4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-h4 Ng1-e2 h7-h6 b2-b3 Bb8-c7 a2-a4 g7-g5 Qa1-c3 Rf8-g8 b3-b4 Bc8-h3 Rf1-g1 a7-a6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Bb1-d3 Rg8-g6 Qc3-c4 Ke8-f8 a4-a5 Bh3-e6 Qc4xa6 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Nf6-d5 Bc1-d2 Nd5xb4 Bd2xb4 Qb8xb4 Bd3xg6 Nh4xg6 Qa6xc6 Bc7xa5 Qc6-c5 Qb4xc5 d4xc5 Ng6xe5 Rd1xd8+ Ba5xd8 Rg1-d1 Ne5-c6 f3-f4 Be6-c4
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Uri Blass
Posts: 11150
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:37 am
Location: Tel-Aviv Israel

Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by Uri Blass »

Here is the rest of the analysis.
Did not get definite conclusions and I will stop the analysis

54/64- 2:02:35 56,986,827k 7,747k +0.51 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
54/66+ 2:07:08 59,077,656k 7,745k +0.59 Nh1-g3
54/66- 2:11:14 60,943,721k 7,739k +0.43 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
54/66+ 2:14:27 62,395,644k 7,734k +0.57 Nh1-g3
54/73+ 2:20:03 64,964,487k 7,731k +0.82 Nh1-g3
54/73 2:30:25 69,664,014k 7,718k +0.88 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 d2-d3 c7-c5 b2-b4 b7-b6 c2-c4 Bc8-g4 Nh5-g3 d5-d4 b4xc5 b6xc5 Qa1-b2 Kf7-g7 Bb1-c2 Kg7-h8 Bc1-d2 f6-f5 Rd1-b1 Ng6-f4 Qb2-b7 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-d1 Qa8xb7 Rb1xb7 Bg4xf3 e2xf3 Ng2-f4 Bc2-a4 Rf8-f6 Kd1-c2 Rf6-a6 Ba4-b3 Rd8-f8 Ng3xf5 Ra6-b6 Rb7xb6 a7xb6 Nf5-g3 Nf4-g2 Bb3-a4 Ng2-h4 Rf1-b1 Nh4xf3 Rb1xb6 Nf3xd2 Kc2xd2 Rf8xf2+ Kd2-d1 Rf2xa2
55/53- 2:47:04 77,322,551k 7,713k +0.80 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
55/77- 4:10:39 115,051,373k 7,650k +0.72 Nh1-g3 d7-d6
55/77+ 4:20:36 119,660,612k 7,653k +0.80 Nh1-g3
55/77+ 4:45:00 130,216,120k 7,615k +0.98 Nh1-g3
55/79 5:35:36 153,444,599k 7,620k +0.62 Nh1-g3 d7-d6 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 d2-d4 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 c7-c6 e2-e4 O-O h2-h3 b7-b5 b2-b3 b5xc4 b3xc4 Bc8-a6 h3-h4 h7-h5 Bb1-d3 Ba6-c8 O-O Bc8-g4 Qa1-b1 Nf6-h7 d4-d5 Bb8-c7 Nf3-d4 Bg4xd1 Rf1xd1 Ng6-e5 Bc1-f4 c6-c5 Nd4-f5 Rd8-d7 Bd3-c2 g7-g6 Bf4xe5 d6xe5 Bc2-a4 Qa8-d8 Ba4xd7 Qd8xd7 Qb1-b5 Qd7-d8 Nf5-e3 Bc7-d6 Ng3-e2 Nh7-f6 Ne2-c3 Qd8-c7 Rd1-b1 Rf8-b8 Qb5xb8+ Qc7xb8 Rb1xb8+ Bd6xb8 a2-a3
56/70+ 5:54:57 162,060,170k 7,609k +0.70 Nh1-g3
56/70+ 6:00:40 164,676,874k 7,610k +0.78 Nh1-g3
56/70 6:10:55 169,400,606k 7,611k +0.81 Nh1-g3 d7-d6 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 d2-d4 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 c7-c6 e2-e4 O-O O-O b7-b5 c4xb5 c6xb5 h2-h3 h7-h6 d4-d5 e7-e5 d5xe6/ep f7xe6 a2-a4 b5xa4 Qa1xa4 Qa8-b7 Rf1-e1 Bb8-c7 Bc1-e3 Bc7-b6 Qa4-a3 Ng6-e5 Nf3xe5 d6xe5 Bb1-d3 Bb6xe3 Re1xe3 Rd8-d4 Rd1-c1 Bc8-d7 b2-b3 Qb7-b6 Bd3-c4 Rf8-f7 Qa3-a6 Qb6xa6 Bc4xa6 h6-h5 Ba6-d3 h5-h4 Ng3-e2 Rd4-b4
57/72- 6:43:03 184,063,759k 7,611k +0.73 Nh1-g3 d7-d6
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MikeB
Posts: 4889
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 6:34 am
Location: Pen Argyl, Pennsylvania

Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by MikeB »

Guenther wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:56 pm
Uri Blass wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:29 pm Did somebody make a long analysis of all of the 960 position and later made a deeper analysis of the positions with the biggest white advantage?
You know this stats from CCRL?
http://computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/404FRC ... able_start
???????? considering that #518 is the standard chess opening. it is listed at the very bottom.
Probably not enough games to rely upon ......

Code: Select all

Opening		Games	Draw %	White win %
RNBQKBNR	472	26.7%	45.1%
Image
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lkaufman
Posts: 6283
Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2010 6:15 am
Location: Maryland USA
Full name: Larry Kaufman

Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by lkaufman »

Uri Blass wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 6:12 pm I get the following analysis for the position that is the most unbalanced position based on statistics.

[d]qbbrkrnn/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/QBBRKRNN w KQkq - 0 1

Stockfish_21041512_x64_avx2:
Found 145 tablebases
NNUE evaluation using nn-62ef826d1a6d.nnue enabled
48/36- 20:22 9,615,247k 7,868k +0.80 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
48/62- 21:06 9,964,567k 7,867k +0.72 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
48/62+ 22:32 10,631,464k 7,861k +0.80 Nh1-g3
48/69+ 28:01 13,203,206k 7,854k +0.98 Nh1-g3
48/69 29:44 13,996,601k 7,843k +0.84 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 d2-d3 c7-c5 b2-b4 b7-b6 c2-c4 d5-d4 b4xc5 b6xc5 Bb1-c2 Ng8-e7 Nh5-g3 Bc8-g4 Qa1-b1 Rf8-g8 Ng3-e4 Bb8-d6 Qb1-b5 Qa8-c8 g2-g3 Bg4xf3 e2xf3 Ng6-f8 O-O f6-f5 Ne4-g5+ Kf7-f6 Ng5-h3 f5-f4 Kg1-g2 Ne7-f5 Nh3-g1 Nf8-e6 Rd1-e1 Rg8-g7 Kg2-h1 Rd8-g8 Qb5-b1 h7-h5 Bc2-d1 Ne6-g5 Qb1-c2
49/63+ 29:56 14,086,817k 7,843k +0.92 Nh1-g3
49/70+ 32:16 15,182,867k 7,839k +1.00 Nh1-g3
49/70 36:57 17,380,126k 7,838k +1.06 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Nf6-h5 b2-b3 f7-f6 d2-d4 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 g7-g6 Nf5-g3 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Bb8-c7 O-O O-O c2-c4 d7-d5 Qa1-c3 Bc8-f5 Bb1xf5 g6xf5 Bc1-f4 Qa8-c8 e2-e3
50/62- 43:11 20,329,387k 7,846k +0.98 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6
50/62- 47:17 22,202,471k 7,824k +0.89 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/72- 54:19 25,472,062k 7,815k +0.59 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/78+ 55:19 25,938,069k 7,815k +0.73 Nh1-g3
50/78- 1:09:12 32,350,508k 7,791k +0.35 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/78+ 1:10:04 32,746,858k 7,789k +0.70 Nh1-g3
50/78 1:10:41 33,019,106k 7,785k +0.47 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-f4 d2-d4 Nf6-h5 Ng1-e2 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Nf4xe2 Kf2xe2 c7-c6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Ke2-f2 Bb8-c7 b2-b3 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Bc8-e6 Bb1-e4 Qb8-b5 Qa1-c3 Be6-d5 a2-a4 Qb5-b7 Bc1-a3 f7-f6 Be4xh7 Qb7xb3 Qc3xb3 Bd5xb3 Rd1-b1 Rd8-b8 Bh7-e4 Ke8-d7 Be4-f5+ Kd7-d8 e5-e6 g7-g6 Bf5-e4 Bb3xe6 Rb1xb8+ Bc7xb8 Be4xc6 Be6-d7 Bc6-e4 Bb8-d6 Ba3xd6 e7xd6 Be4xg6 Bd7xa4
51/61+ 1:12:14 33,731,901k 7,782k +0.55 Nh1-g3
51/70+ 1:12:52 34,026,166k 7,782k +0.63 Nh1-g3
51/70+ 1:13:24 34,257,259k 7,777k +0.76 Nh1-g3
51/70 1:14:04 34,537,913k 7,772k +0.41 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-f4 d2-d4 Nf6-h5 Ng1-e2 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Nf4xe2 Kf2xe2 c7-c6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Ke2-f2 Bb8-c7 b2-b3 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Bc8-e6 Bb1-e4 Qb8-b5 Qa1-c3 Be6-d5 g3-g4 Bc7-a5 Qc3-c2 Ba5-b6 Bc1-e3 f7-f6 e5xf6 Rf8xf6 g4-g5 Bd5xe4 Qc2xe4 Rf6-f5 Rf1-h1 Qb5-d5 Qe4xd5 Rf5xd5 Rh1xh7 Ke8-f7 Kf2-g3 Bb6xd4
52/21+ 1:14:39 34,798,646k 7,769k +0.49 Nh1-g3
52/21+ 1:15:24 35,143,808k 7,768k +0.57 Nh1-g3
52/21+ 1:16:07 35,479,036k 7,768k +0.70 Nh1-g3
52/70 1:19:21 36,906,034k 7,751k +0.55 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 c7-c6 d2-d4 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-h4 b2-b4 h7-h6 Qa1-c3 g7-g5 a2-a4 a7-a6 Ng1-e2 Bc8-h3 Rf1-g1 Qa8-a7 d5xc6 b7xc6 Bc1-e3 Qa7-b7 Rd1-c1 Bh3-d7 Qc3-c4 Bd7-g4 Qc4xc6+ Qb7xc6 Rc1xc6 Bg4xf3 h2-h3 g5-g4 Rc6xf6 e7xf6 h3xg4 Rf8-g8 Bb1-d3 Rg8xg4 Bd3xa6 f6-f5 Ng3xf5 Nh4xf5 Kf2xf3 Nf5xe3 Kf3xe3 Bb8-f4+ Ke3-d3 Rg4xg1 Ba6-b5+ Ke8-e7 Ne2xg1 h6-h5 Bb5-c6
53/27+ 1:24:24 39,225,326k 7,745k +0.63 Nh1-g3
53/61- 1:30:44 42,157,413k 7,743k +0.47 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
53/61+ 1:32:21 42,922,390k 7,745k +0.59 Nh1-g3
53/71+ 1:36:40 44,935,008k 7,746k +0.76 Nh1-g3
53/73 1:41:03 47,000,937k 7,751k +0.59 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 c7-c6 d2-d4 Ng6-h4 f2-f3 Nh4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-h4 Ng1-e2 h7-h6 b2-b3 Bb8-c7 a2-a4 g7-g5 Qa1-c3 Rf8-g8 b3-b4 Bc8-h3 Rf1-g1 a7-a6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Bb1-d3 Rg8-g6 Qc3-c4 Ke8-f8 a4-a5 Bh3-e6 Qc4xa6 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Nf6-d5 Bc1-d2 Nd5xb4 Bd2xb4 Qb8xb4 Bd3xg6 Nh4xg6 Qa6xc6 Bc7xa5 Qc6-c5 Qb4xc5 d4xc5 Ng6xe5 Rd1xd8+ Ba5xd8 Rg1-d1 Ne5-c6 f3-f4 Be6-c4
Stockfish evaluations are roughly 40-50% exaggerated on average (i.e. a pawn up with everything else in balance shows way more than a plus one pawn score), so roughly speaking an eval of about 1.00 on SF is the dividing line (in midgame) between a win and a draw. So even this position is very likely drawn with best play.
Komodo rules!
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Guenther
Posts: 4718
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 6:33 am
Location: Regensburg, Germany
Full name: Guenther Simon

Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by Guenther »

MikeB wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 11:25 pm
Guenther wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:56 pm
Uri Blass wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:29 pm Did somebody make a long analysis of all of the 960 position and later made a deeper analysis of the positions with the biggest white advantage?
You know this stats from CCRL?
http://computerchess.org.uk/ccrl/404FRC ... able_start
???????? considering that #518 is the standard chess opening. it is listed at the very bottom.
Probably not enough games to rely upon ......

Code: Select all

Opening		Games	Draw %	White win %
RNBQKBNR	472	26.7%	45.1%
Yeah, I have to agree those stats are meaningless, not only due to the low number of games, but even more because
the difference in strength of the matched program pairs and the overall strength of used programs randomly distributed
over all positions.
Such a test should be conducted like a book test and with 10000s of games. With that number of positions
and the need of repeating it with the second and third best program we won't see such a test in our lifetime.
https://rwbc-chess.de

[Trolls n'existent pas...]
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Chessqueen
Posts: 5685
Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:16 am
Location: Moving
Full name: Jorge Picado

Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by Chessqueen »

lkaufman wrote: ↑Mon Apr 26, 2021 2:25 am
Uri Blass wrote: ↑Sun Apr 25, 2021 6:12 pm I get the following analysis for the position that is the most unbalanced position based on statistics.

[d]qbbrkrnn/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/QBBRKRNN w KQkq - 0 1

Stockfish_21041512_x64_avx2:
Found 145 tablebases
NNUE evaluation using nn-62ef826d1a6d.nnue enabled
48/36- 20:22 9,615,247k 7,868k +0.80 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
48/62- 21:06 9,964,567k 7,867k +0.72 Nh1-g3 b7-b6
48/62+ 22:32 10,631,464k 7,861k +0.80 Nh1-g3
48/69+ 28:01 13,203,206k 7,854k +0.98 Nh1-g3
48/69 29:44 13,996,601k 7,843k +0.84 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 Ng3-h5 f7-f6 Nh5xg7+ Ke8-f7 Ng7-h5 Nh8-g6 Ng1-f3 e7-e5 d2-d3 c7-c5 b2-b4 b7-b6 c2-c4 d5-d4 b4xc5 b6xc5 Bb1-c2 Ng8-e7 Nh5-g3 Bc8-g4 Qa1-b1 Rf8-g8 Ng3-e4 Bb8-d6 Qb1-b5 Qa8-c8 g2-g3 Bg4xf3 e2xf3 Ng6-f8 O-O f6-f5 Ne4-g5+ Kf7-f6 Ng5-h3 f5-f4 Kg1-g2 Ne7-f5 Nh3-g1 Nf8-e6 Rd1-e1 Rg8-g7 Kg2-h1 Rd8-g8 Qb5-b1 h7-h5 Bc2-d1 Ne6-g5 Qb1-c2
49/63+ 29:56 14,086,817k 7,843k +0.92 Nh1-g3
49/70+ 32:16 15,182,867k 7,839k +1.00 Nh1-g3
49/70 36:57 17,380,126k 7,838k +1.06 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6 Ng3-f5 Nf6-h5 b2-b3 f7-f6 d2-d4 c7-c6 Ng1-f3 g7-g6 Nf5-g3 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Bb8-c7 O-O O-O c2-c4 d7-d5 Qa1-c3 Bc8-f5 Bb1xf5 g6xf5 Bc1-f4 Qa8-c8 e2-e3
50/62- 43:11 20,329,387k 7,846k +0.98 Nh1-g3 Ng8-f6
50/62- 47:17 22,202,471k 7,824k +0.89 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/72- 54:19 25,472,062k 7,815k +0.59 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/78+ 55:19 25,938,069k 7,815k +0.73 Nh1-g3
50/78- 1:09:12 32,350,508k 7,791k +0.35 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
50/78+ 1:10:04 32,746,858k 7,789k +0.70 Nh1-g3
50/78 1:10:41 33,019,106k 7,785k +0.47 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-f4 d2-d4 Nf6-h5 Ng1-e2 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Nf4xe2 Kf2xe2 c7-c6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Ke2-f2 Bb8-c7 b2-b3 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Bc8-e6 Bb1-e4 Qb8-b5 Qa1-c3 Be6-d5 a2-a4 Qb5-b7 Bc1-a3 f7-f6 Be4xh7 Qb7xb3 Qc3xb3 Bd5xb3 Rd1-b1 Rd8-b8 Bh7-e4 Ke8-d7 Be4-f5+ Kd7-d8 e5-e6 g7-g6 Bf5-e4 Bb3xe6 Rb1xb8+ Bc7xb8 Be4xc6 Be6-d7 Bc6-e4 Bb8-d6 Ba3xd6 e7xd6 Be4xg6 Bd7xa4
51/61+ 1:12:14 33,731,901k 7,782k +0.55 Nh1-g3
51/70+ 1:12:52 34,026,166k 7,782k +0.63 Nh1-g3
51/70+ 1:13:24 34,257,259k 7,777k +0.76 Nh1-g3
51/70 1:14:04 34,537,913k 7,772k +0.41 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-f4 d2-d4 Nf6-h5 Ng1-e2 Nh5xg3 h2xg3 Nf4xe2 Kf2xe2 c7-c6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Ke2-f2 Bb8-c7 b2-b3 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Bc8-e6 Bb1-e4 Qb8-b5 Qa1-c3 Be6-d5 g3-g4 Bc7-a5 Qc3-c2 Ba5-b6 Bc1-e3 f7-f6 e5xf6 Rf8xf6 g4-g5 Bd5xe4 Qc2xe4 Rf6-f5 Rf1-h1 Qb5-d5 Qe4xd5 Rf5xd5 Rh1xh7 Ke8-f7 Kf2-g3 Bb6xd4
52/21+ 1:14:39 34,798,646k 7,769k +0.49 Nh1-g3
52/21+ 1:15:24 35,143,808k 7,768k +0.57 Nh1-g3
52/21+ 1:16:07 35,479,036k 7,768k +0.70 Nh1-g3
52/70 1:19:21 36,906,034k 7,751k +0.55 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 Ng6-f4 f2-f3 c7-c6 d2-d4 Nf4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-h4 b2-b4 h7-h6 Qa1-c3 g7-g5 a2-a4 a7-a6 Ng1-e2 Bc8-h3 Rf1-g1 Qa8-a7 d5xc6 b7xc6 Bc1-e3 Qa7-b7 Rd1-c1 Bh3-d7 Qc3-c4 Bd7-g4 Qc4xc6+ Qb7xc6 Rc1xc6 Bg4xf3 h2-h3 g5-g4 Rc6xf6 e7xf6 h3xg4 Rf8-g8 Bb1-d3 Rg8xg4 Bd3xa6 f6-f5 Ng3xf5 Nh4xf5 Kf2xf3 Nf5xe3 Kf3xe3 Bb8-f4+ Ke3-d3 Rg4xg1 Ba6-b5+ Ke8-e7 Ne2xg1 h6-h5 Bb5-c6
53/27+ 1:24:24 39,225,326k 7,745k +0.63 Nh1-g3
53/61- 1:30:44 42,157,413k 7,743k +0.47 Nh1-g3 d7-d5
53/61+ 1:32:21 42,922,390k 7,745k +0.59 Nh1-g3
53/71+ 1:36:40 44,935,008k 7,746k +0.76 Nh1-g3
53/73 1:41:03 47,000,937k 7,751k +0.59 Nh1-g3 d7-d5 c2-c4 Ng8-f6 c4xd5 Nh8-g6 e2-e4 c7-c6 d2-d4 Ng6-h4 f2-f3 Nh4xg2+ Ke1-f2 Ng2-h4 Ng1-e2 h7-h6 b2-b3 Bb8-c7 a2-a4 g7-g5 Qa1-c3 Rf8-g8 b3-b4 Bc8-h3 Rf1-g1 a7-a6 d5xc6 b7xc6 Bb1-d3 Rg8-g6 Qc3-c4 Ke8-f8 a4-a5 Bh3-e6 Qc4xa6 Qa8-b8 e4-e5 Nf6-d5 Bc1-d2 Nd5xb4 Bd2xb4 Qb8xb4 Bd3xg6 Nh4xg6 Qa6xc6 Bc7xa5 Qc6-c5 Qb4xc5 d4xc5 Ng6xe5 Rd1xd8+ Ba5xd8 Rg1-d1 Ne5-c6 f3-f4 Be6-c4
Stockfish evaluations are roughly 40-50% exaggerated on average (i.e. a pawn up with everything else in balance shows way more than a plus one pawn score), so roughly speaking an eval of about 1.00 on SF is the dividing line (in midgame) between a win and a draw. So even this position is very likely drawn with best play.

I was just thinking, but I am not sure if it make sense or NOT, but it might change the order of these top engines in FRC standing.
Well I saw that Larry posted "Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?" and based on the number of White score I believe that if we
take these four leading FRC 960 engines and these 50 FRC 960 positions the order might change specially between Fat Fritz2 and Dragon.


1 Stockfish 190321 3855 +14 −14 77.9% −209.9 37.1% 2150
100.0%
2 Fat Fritz 2 3816 +10 −11 66.3% −119.7 51.6% 3020
100.0%
3 Dragon by Komodo 3793 +10 −10 67.8% −135.8 42.7% 3770
100.0%
4 Houdini 6 3635 +7 −6 60.1% −72.7 40.9% 10386





NBRNQKBR 304 24.0% 50.5% 0.21 MB
NBBRKNRQ 320 26.6% 50.5% 0.22 MB
BRNKNRQB 328 32.0% 50.5% 0.21 MB
RNBQKNRB 344 24.1% 50.4% 0.24 MB
BBNRQKRN 348 34.8% 50.4% 0.25 MB
NRKBBRQN 352 27.0% 50.4% 0.25 MB
QRBKNBRN 356 25.6% 50.4% 0.26 MB
RQBBNNKR 364 29.9% 50.4% 0.26 MB
RBBKQNRN 368 23.1% 50.4% 0.25 MB
NQRKNRBB 380 20.8% 50.4% 0.25 MB
NBQRNKBR 301 23.6% 50.3% 0.21 MB
RBBQNKRN 312 35.3% 50.3% 0.22 MB
RKBRQBNN 314 34.4% 50.3% 0.22 MB
BRQNKRNB 316 29.7% 50.3% 0.21 MB
BQNBRNKR 325 26.2% 50.3% 0.22 MB
RQNNBBKR 334 29.9% 50.3% 0.25 MB
BQNRKRNB 346 33.5% 50.3% 0.25 MB
QNBRNKRB 353 28.0% 50.3% 0.24 MB
QBRNNKBR 356 25.8% 50.3% 0.25 MB
RBNNKRBQ 356 26.4% 50.3% 0.24 MB
QNRBNKBR 363 28.4% 50.3% 0.25 MB
RNNQBBKR 298 31.9% 50.2% 0.22 MB
QNBRKBRN 304 26.6% 50.2% 0.22 MB
RKNRBNQB 318 21.1% 50.2% 0.21 MB
RKBNNQRB 318 24.2% 50.2% 0.21 MB
BRQNKNRB 326 26.7% 50.2% 0.22 MB
BQRNKNRB 336 30.7% 50.1% 0.23 MB
NBRNKQBR 340 25.0% 50.1% 0.24 MB
RKRNBNQB 340 22.1% 50.1% 0.24 MB
BBRKNNRQ 344 25.3% 50.1% 0.23 MB
BBQNRNKR 345 22.0% 50.1% 0.22 MB
BRKBRNNQ 362 26.2% 50.1% 0.24 MB
RKRBBNQN 368 22.6% 50.1% 0.26 MB
RNBKRNQB 372 22.3% 50.1% 0.26 MB
QRKNBBRN 324 20.4% 50.0% 0.21 MB
BRQBNKNR 310 31.6% 50.0% 0.23 MB
BNQRKBNR 330 30.9% 50.0% 0.23 MB
QRKRBBNN 344 26.7% 50.0% 0.24 MB
BBNRKNRQ 350 21.1% 50.0% 0.23 MB
NNQRBKRB 309 26.9% 50.0% 0.20 MB
RBBQNNKR 312 37.8% 50.0% 0.24 MB
BRNKNQRB 368 34.8% 50.0% 0.25 MB
BRKBNQRN 336 28.0% 50.0% 0.23 MB
BRQNNBKR 336 26.2% 50.0% 0.24 MB
BQRNKBNR 366 29.2% 49.9% 0.26 MB
RNQNKRBB 362 21.8% 49.9% 0.25 MB
QRBNNBKR 360 25.3% 49.9% 0.25 MB
QRBNKBRN 344 21.8% 49.9% 0.25 MB
RBBQKRNN 334 26.0% 49.9% 0.24 MB
NQRKBNRB 318 24.2% 49.8% 0.22 MB
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Chessqueen
Posts: 5685
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Re: Are all 960 positions from FRC a draw?

Post by Chessqueen »

Have you seen the positions that GM So had when he beat GM Carlsen for the FRC 960 Championship, I will let you search it so you can draw your own conclusion, and if these 10 positions where the only positions chosen Carlsen would probably had beating GM So :roll:
You can check the other 3 960 positions, by yourself







QRKNBBRN 324 20.4% 50.0% 0.21 MB
BRQBNKNR 310 31.6% 50.0% 0.23 MB
BNQRKBNR 330 30.9% 50.0% 0.23 MB
QRKRBBNN 344 26.7% 50.0% 0.24 MB
BBNRKNRQ 350 21.1% 50.0% 0.23 MB
NNQRBKRB 309 26.9% 50.0% 0.20 MB
RBBQNNKR 312 37.8% 50.0% 0.24 MB
BRNKNQRB 368 34.8% 50.0% 0.25 MB
BRKBNQRN 336 28.0% 50.0% 0.23 MB
BRQNNBKR 336 26.2% 50.0% 0.24 MB
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