Kranium is a true hero!

[slobo]

- he completely ported the 1st code from linux to windows;

If by that you mean "ruined" it, I'll agree. It is easy to isolate the windows/linux differences to 2 files, totaling 2KB, one of which is the only one that needs windows.h. I should add that the only compiler dependent changes I made in that file were to silence warnings during the windows.h #include, but since it's just a quick couple #ifdef directives, the file is compiler agnostic too.

I cannot discuss with you about this. The right persons to do it would be:
1. programers who have worked with Norman, and also
2. Norman himself.

As Misha said, the current situation is very unfair to him: he could be blamed without any possibility to defend himself.

- it was very unstable; he got it stable;

I don't know what you mean unless it was instability that stemmed from other changes he made. Other than a gigantic list of warnings, I had no trouble with robbolito nor ippolite running on a mips32 device for over a week each playing 24/7.

About Ippolit's stability:
In the beginning of Ippolit's real existence, it was not possible to play long time control games because this engine was crashing (stopping playing moves, lost in its calculations). When Ippolit was improved and able to play long TC games, it became Robbolito. It was basicaly Norman's work, but not only his own. Other guys helped him, Sentinel in the first place.

I would like to see Norman's return to this community. He surely could explain better than me what he did or what he did not. Now, while he is banned, it is easy to diminish his merits.

[bnemias]

I cannot discuss with you about this. The right persons to do it would be:
1. programers who have worked with Norman, and also
2. Norman himself.

As Misha said, the current situation is very unfair to him: he could be blamed without any possibility to defend himself.

Agreed. Is his ban permanent, or does he get to come back at some time, or does anyone know?

About Ippolit's stability:
In the beginning of Ippolit's real existence, it was not possible to play long time control games because this engine was crashing (stopping playing moves, lost in its calculations). When Ippolit was improved and able to play long TC games, it became Robbolito. It was basicaly Norman's work, but not only his own. Other guys helped him, Sentinel in the first place.

I never observed that, and I used versions prior to robbolito. But if it's specific to long games, then I suppose it's possible because the formula on the bot I ran for over a week limited games to less than 6 minutes each.

I would like to see Norman's return to this community. He surely could explain better than me what he did or what he did not. Now, while he is banned, it is easy to diminish his merits.

I agree. However, the converse doesn't seem to be true-- regarding him as a hero as the title of this thread suggests. For those who don't fully agree, it seems they ought to be able to voice that opinion.

[bnemias]

- he completely ported the 1st code from linux to windows;

If by that you mean "ruined" it, I'll agree. It is easy to isolate the windows/linux differences to 2 files, totaling 2KB, one of which is the only one that needs windows.h. I should add that the only compiler dependent changes I made in that file were to silence warnings during the windows.h #include, but since it's just a quick couple #ifdef directives, the file is compiler agnostic too.

I cannot discuss with you about this. The right persons to do it would be:
1. programers who have worked with Norman, and also
2. Norman himself.

As Misha said, the current situation is very unfair to him: he could be blamed without any possibility to defend himself.

Since he can't defend himself as you and Misha point out, I should add that my current tree is based on the linux port that he had hosted at his site which he was kind enough to include. And for that I am thankful, even if I have to roll my eyes at the idea of having to backport to linux what was originally a linux project. Heh.

[Uri Blass]

Kranium's work is notable. Even that ipplite is the strongest engine in the earth, few people want to develop it. I don't know why.
Bob is another hero, I suggest him to develop ipplite with cluster.[/b]

No reason to develop it.

It is better if stockfish becomes the best engine.

I understand that stockfish is clearly more code friendly to people who want to improve chess engines
and it is not reversed engineered from some b language when you cannot see the full original code.

I hope that stockfish becomes the best engine in a few months.

Uri

[alpha123]

Kranium's work is notable. Even that ipplite is the strongest engine in the earth, few people want to develop it. I don't know why.
Bob is another hero, I suggest him to develop ipplite with cluster.[/b]

No reason to develop it.

It is better if stockfish becomes the best engine.

I understand that stockfish is clearly more code friendly to people who want to improve chess engines
and it is not reversed engineered from some b language when you cannot see the full original code.

I hope that stockfish becomes the best engine in a few months.

Uri

Well, at the rate it's advancing at.....That shouldn't be an issue .

I would also prefer that Stockfish is the strongest, though Robbo is a fine engine too.

Peter

[Damir]

Stockfish got stronger because of Robbolito's open source.
Would that still have been the case if Robbolito did not appear ?
Probably not...

[BubbaTough]

Stockfish got stronger because of Robbolito's open source.
Would that still have been the case if Robbolito did not appear ?
Probably not...

hmmmm.....what an odd thing to say. I think it is pretty obvious to everyone, whether they consider it a "clone" or not, that Robbolito authors have gained way more from looking at other people's code than the Stockfish authors.

-Sam

[gerold]

Stockfish got stronger because of Robbolito's open source.
Would that still have been the case if Robbolito did not appear ?
Probably not...

If you are saying that SF is a clone of Robb i would like to
see you prove it.
If it is a clone of Robb i will no longer use it.

Best,

Gerold.

[Sven]

Stockfish got stronger because of Robbolito's open source.
Would that still have been the case if Robbolito did not appear ?
Probably not...

Since all sources are open it will be an easy task for you to show to us all which parts of Robbolito have influenced Stockfish and "made it stronger".

- If your claim is correct then there must be pieces of code where we can see this. Maybe you post this in the programming forum, and link to it here. Please don't forget to compare the right versions.

- If your claim is false then I would ask why you have written that.

In my opinion Stockfish, as its predecessor Glaurung, was already a very strong engine before Ippolit/Robbolito/... appeared, and the Stockfish improvements are original work of the Stockfish team.

Sven

[Gian-Carlo Pascutto]

There's no need to fall for this continuous trolling, I already pointed out in the Stockfish 1.6 release discussion which ideas in the new Stockfish were in RobboLito and which ones were original.

This forum has really become unreadable since all the RobboLito trolls appeared. I hope that the new moderators, whoever they are, take more asservative action in that manner.